The Beautiful People of the Ancestral Health Symposium #AHS11

OK, here's the first post featuring photos taken by others during the AHS. What you should note is the huge percentage of people who look like a human animal should look, and it's not just body composition, but skin tone, hair, absence of redness and inflammation, and bright eyes.

Of course, Vegans and Vegetarians with their orthorexic eating disorders, who think POWs look fat, will probably have a different view.

Thanks to Julia Kohli, Arron Blaisdell and Tess McEnulty for the photos.

046
 
photoo
 
IMG 1143
 
051
 
IMG 1067
 
IMG 1079
 
053
 
IMG 1089
 
IMG 1138
 
054
 
IMG 1115
 

Tess also uploaded 70 various AHS photos to her Picasa space. Go have a look. And if anyone else has images similarly available on any of the photo sharing sites feel free to shoot me the link and I'll add it to the post.

I think it's great to present as much of the whole flavor and excitement of the event to those who did not attend as possible. I want to see 2,000+ attendees next year. Let's make it happen.

Update: From commenter Jolly, who was the guy snapping professional quality pics everywhere.

1000 photos, cut down to 234.
Facebook Day 1
Facebook Day 2
Flickr

Comments

  1. LOVE the heap of shoes!

  2. Jimmy Moore looks awesome!

    • He’s got a ways to go and I hope he’s got things nailed down in the right direction. I support him fully. He is a sweet sweet man and an asset to the Ancestral community.

  3. Lute Nikoley says:

    I’d like to see some pictures of some older geezers like me. so I can compare. I see a lot of people wear shoes. I like the meat, I assume it’s all grass fed, natural and wild caught fish.

  4. Candice says:

    I will totally be one of the +2000 – so regret not just doing it this year!

  5. I don’t buy it. All those people must be raw, fruit-eating vegans (except maybe that fellow on the far right of the fifth photo). Everyone knows that paleo people are overweight and paunchy. [\sarcasm]

  6. I like that the fish on the grill looks like it wants to eat all that beef…like right now!

  7. I agree – everyone looks great. But I’d be willing to wager that the healthiest among you were the true big-tent paleo types (i.e., the ones not phobic about any one particular macronutrient). I highly doubt a similar gathering of dogmatic low-carbers would look anywhere near like this (low-carb cruise, anyone?). Yes, Jimmy Moore IS a sweet guy, but I hope he can somehow move away from spreading a message that, for the vast majority, simply doesn’t work long-term (highly doubtful because he’s financially wedded to this worldview). Paleo is becoming so popular precisely, I think, because it IS sustainable – something that can hardly be said for Atkins, Eades, et al. Gary Taubes, too, has to realize on some level that the writing’s on the wall – at least when it comes it to his theory on insulin. I think this explains his rude behavior toward Stephan. That and he just needs to eat some more carbs.

    • Unless you’re eating tons of potatoes, even Paleo is not going to be as high-carb as the Standard Industrial Diet. And sorry, but some of us don’t do that hot on the tons of potatoes. I’ll grant you that under other circumstances we might have been able to tolerate them better, but NOW we cannot tolerate them, and unless we get whatever caused our intolerance to go away, eating high-carb would be phenomenally stupid.

      Usually people who have issues with Taubes and insulin say that some other body chemical also causes obesity. Right, because there are tons of *untreated* type 1 diabetics waddling around weighing 500 pounds. The only overweight type 1s I *ever* run into are ones who think they should be able to eat any crap they want as long as they cover it with their insulin. I’m sure they’re just gobsmacked why they’re losing kidney function in their fifties, too.

      And while I love Stephan’s blog for the most part, his claims about people being fat because food tastes good are just insane.

      • “And while I love Stephan’s blog for the most part, his claims about people being fat because food tastes good are just insane.”

        Given the fact that you have seem to have no knowledge or interest in what the Food Reward theory is really all about (and that Stephan was elaborating on other’s work), I think “insane” might be a rather strong double-edged word.

        By the way, I believe Kurt Harris came out the other day and said that Food Reward was the 4th NAD. It is interesting how all these people pretty smart people are not mentioning “carbs” though.

        It is not really a matter of whether Atkins is good diet program or not; it is whether the condemnation of an entire class of macronutrients is really what Ancestral Health is all about and the direction it is (or should be) going.

    • It’s also worth noting that a lot of (not all, obviously) Paleo eaters started out relatively healthy or at least dialed in to some kind of fitness community and didn’t have 200 pounds to lose in the first place. Whereas people who adopt a generic low-carb approach are probably more likely to have been hugely fat when they began. You cannot judge the success of someone’s weight-loss approach until they have been at it for some time, and even then you probably should withhold judgment because what if they’re hypothyroid, or have some other hormonal imbalance (whoops, insulin’s a hormone) or some other misfortune going on? You will find Paleo people with the same problem. I just got done seeing someone comment on Chris Kessler’s page that she’s been stricken with a wicked case of gastritis ever since she went Paleo. I think the Paleo movement is an awesome thing to behold but watch the generalizations.

    • Oh and a couple more things. Sorry, Richard, for the Posty McPostPost.

      1. Eades is VERY Paleo-sympathetic. Have you even read his damn blog???

      2. I cannot speak for all low-carb plans because I have not read them all. But I know for a fact Protein Power and the Atkins diet can both be made Paleo. I have three editions of the Atkins book (yes, THREE) because I was fascinated at the evolution of the doctor’s thinking and writing style over time–and not once does he require that people eat something that wouldn’t be kosher on any Paleo-type diet. He *allowed* certain things that would be no-nos, like canola oil (in the last edition he put out before he died–no one was using canola in 1970), but nobody said you had to eat them.

      In fact, if anyone ever bothers *reading* Atkins, at the end of the day you don’t stay at 20g a day of carbs unless there is something seriously wrong with you. The entire diet plan is about starting out very low and gradually re-introducing carbs. You’re supposed to find your individual upper tolerance level of carbs so that you can prevent future fat gain. How is that NOT conducive to healthy Paleo?

      Even Taubes eats vegetables, for crying out loud. So does Eades. So did Atkins. Good grief.

      • Dana, you have long earned the right to post whatever the fuck you want here. I trust you and always wish you the best

      • The Eades and Jimmy Moore and many other dogmatic low-carbers are embracing paleo because, well, if nothing else they’re smart businesspeople and can certainly recognize a good thing when they see it. Mark my words: If paleo as a movement gets in bed with the LC/VLC crowd, it’ll get labeled a fad diet and achieve the same ‘revolutionary’ status as Protein Power and Kimkins and Dr. Atkins’ New Diet Revolution – in other words, not very revolutionary or earth-shattering at all. The low-carb forums are bursting at the seams with people attempting to lose the same 10, 20, 50 lbs. over and over and over again – but unable to because they’re sticking to the ‘calories don’t count’ party line. That’s real-world proof. I don’t even need to mention all the prominent LCers who look nothing like most of the people at AHS. Bottom line: paleo’s something different. If you let failed low-carbers hijack your movement, you’ll end up in the same place they did.

      • gallier2 says:

        Who are you to decide for others what their motivation is? Even putting Kimkins, a convicted scammer, in the same line as Dr.Eades or Jimmy Moore, shows who the “broad brush painter” here is. People like Eades or Naughton embrace paleo not because they think it is a fad and can make the quick buck, but because it makes sense.
        Sorry to tell you, but you as the other paleo-orthodoxists more of a problem, than the low-carbers. And in case you havened noticed yet, but paleo is dead, several of the luminaries of paleo are trying to kill the “paleo” characterisation because it is more a hinderance than anything else (Harris’ archevore, Gnolls’ functional paleo and other bloggers attempts to rename the thing).

      • Condemning an entire class of macronutrient (ala “low-carb”), intransigently claiming that “carbs” are the one and only cause of the diseases of civilization (ala Taubes), and hawking processed food diet bars (ala Moore) are legitimate concerns and issues for the Ancestral Health movement. I don’t really see people that share these concerns are “paleo-orthodox” or that they are “more of a problem than low carbers”.

        I think it is much more of a problem that some very smart people (Guyenet, Harris, Masterjohn, etc…) within the movement keep saying to look beyond macronutrients and to look at Real Food, and other people keeping point to Taubes and Atkins(!) and saying “no, we can’t do that.”

      • Galina L. says:

        If they say that they can’t sustain optimal health on real food may be they just can’t. People indeed have different ability to tolerate carbs in their diet, especially somebody with an obesity issue in past or present.

      • When I think of dogmatic people, Michael Eades and Jimmy Moore are the last ones to spring to mind. Actually, what I think of are people who write like you do, Erika.

        Paleo IS a fad diet in the sense that the label has already been co-opted by purists such as yourself, as gallier2 pointed out. Looking at diet from an evolutionary perspective is not something that’s going away soon, it’s a blunt tool, but a necesary one until much finer tools come along. Trying to create some clear delineation between LC and paleo is like trying to separate Copernicus from Newton or Kepler.

        Oh and calories don’t count. Not in the sense that people who talk about calories and have no knowledge of thermodynamics mean. This isn’t some sort of party line. It’s the difference between a basic grasp of entropy and being a fucking dittohead.

      • “Trying to create some clear delineation between LC and paleo is like trying to separate Copernicus from Newton or Kepler.”

        I think you are implying that it is difficult, though I kinda question your analogy.

        LC condemns an entire class of macronutrients, while Ancestral / Paleo 2.0 is focused on Real Food. How about that for a distinction? Want more? Paleo 2.0 has a list of potential Neolithic Agents of Disease, but “carbs” are not on it. How about more? The best scientific minds in Ancestral / Paleo 2.0 reject Taubes’ insulin hypothesis, but LC rallies around it.

        I think a bright person could come up with some more ways, but that is enough for me.

      • What I’m “implying” is that these theories were all related. None of them existed in a vacuum.

        What is Real Food? I use this term myself but what does it mean? Paleo 2.0, you want to define that? I’m not aware that Kurt Harris ever rejected Gary Taube’s insulin hypothesis, and I’m not aware that the point of GCBC was the insulin hypothesis. Have you actually read the book?

        What are these best minds of “Ancestral/Paleo 2.0″ you speak of?

        That you didn’t understand the relation of Newton, Galileo and Copernicus, your simplistic view of Taubes, and your infatuation with labels over substance is not a coincidence.

      • Galina L. says:

        When you call some food “real food” it does sound like something that fit some ideological criteria, not describe any nutritional quality of that food or reaction of some individual on it. Honey is a good example. Not good for many, good for some in small amount.I know a lot of people who question things like milk or milk products consumption, or eating white rice. For many low-carbers decision about what to eat is done on glucosameter readings , not on abstract ideas about condemning nutrients.

      • “Paleo 2.0, you want to define that? I’m not aware that Kurt Harris ever rejected Gary Taube’s insulin hypothesis.”

        Not much of a Kurt Harris fan are you? He’s a bright guy – you should check out his site. He answers these questions for you, and he even has some posts there explaining why speaking in terms of “carbs” has very little value.

        “What are these best minds of “Ancestral/Paleo 2.0″ you speak of?”

        Actually, I said best “scientific” minds – Guyenet, Masterjohn, Harris, et al.

        “…and your infatuation with labels over substance…”

        Afraid you lost me there. I was just pointing out that it is not too difficult to delineate key differences between low carber ideology and ancestral health ideology. If you want more substance, like I said, go read Kurt Harris’s site or Stephan Guyenet’s or Chris Masterjohn’s.

      • That is a good point, Galina. The dose makes the poison, even for some Real Foods.

      • As one of the minds you are speaking of (I use and recommend the term functional paleo), “reject” is too strong a word. As with any hypothesis, there is the strong and the weak version.

        The strong version of the carb/insulin hypothesis is that carbs are the ONLY factor in weight gain. The weak version is that excess carbs are an IMPORTANT factor in weight gain. Go watch the first few minutes of Dr. Doug McGuff’s AHS presentation (once it’s available) to understand what “excess” means, and why carbs are still a very important contributor to obesity.

        I’ll be discussing this very subject, and how all these pieces fit together, in future installments of my “Why Are We Hungry?” series, currently on Part III.

        JS

      • Thanks JS! I look forward to and enjoy your illuminating and highly informative posts. It was great to put a face to the personality and the voice (I recognized you the moment you spoke).

      • Kurt Harris on Gary Taubes (two days ago):

        I heard Taubes on saturday on NPR – his first appearance on People’s Pharmacy since I heard him in the fall of 2007. He has not changed his stance a bit as far as I can tell. His carbohydrate hypothesis – “carbs or “easily digestible carbs” almost solely drive weight gain and metabolic syndrome – has not changed. A few mentions of sugar and fructose in particular causing insulin resistance, but as yet no acknowledgement that the crude macronutrient ratio (fraction of carbs) is anything other than the main determinant of obesity and metabolic derangement. This is the hazard of writing books. You get married to them. One of the reasons I have resisted so far, and very glad I have….

        The NAD are reduced by a low carb diet, but the NAD are NOT carbohydrates. They are excess fructose (one carbohydrate), gluten and gliadins (protein) and excess linoleic acid (fat). And I would consider Stephan’s food reward to be a good candidate for the fourth NAD – excess palatability itself as an agent of disease. Like the other NADS, it may be neither necessary nor sufficient by itself to cause excess caloric intake leading to metabolic syndrome. But it probably plays a big role and despite some definitional problems (the definition is a bit circular) the theory as laid out by Stephan seems pretty sound.

        Polymers of glucose (starch) in whole foods are innocent in the development of obesity and metabolic syndrome, and IMO starch is not a NAD. I’ve not thought so for quite some time, and I am more convinced as time goes by. If you are not already diabetic, it’s a horse a piece health wise if you get your fuel from animal fats or root vegetables. Think multi-fuel stove…

        Taubes’ contributions in slaying the diet/heart hypothesis will stand, but Stephan’s view of the causes of obesity/ met syn will prove to be closer to the truth than Taubes’.

      • To follow-up and add-on to Michael’s KGH quote, this is from Kurt Harris last December right here on Free the Animal:

        “Like many, I did indeed start by believing that macronutrient ratios (high fractions of starch) could per se cause metabolic derangement.

        However I no longer believe this as it quickly became apparent to me that the anthropological and ethological records simply do not support this assumption, nor does it fit with what we know about insulin function, pathological insulin resistance and what we are learning about leptin.

        Discussion of “carbohydrate” as a class of foods is as uninformative as discussing the merits of “fat”.”

        http://freetheanimal.com/2010/12/weekend-links-quick-hits-gary-taubes-art-de-vany-denise-minger-the-china-study-chris-masterjohn-and-real-results.html#comment-53991

        Interestingly, Stephan Guyenet has just recently said that he is going to take the kid gloves off in dealing with Taubes after the incident at the AHS.

        http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/08/ancestral-health-symposium-drama.html

      • And KGH’s comment to Stephan’s “taking of the kid gloves” post”:

        “One of your best posts, Stephan.

        Gary Taubes has certainly made real contributions with GCBC, by skewering the diet-heart hypothesis and stimulating interest in the idea of the nutritional transition, but his conception of the carbohydrate hypothesis – focusing on the crude macronutrient category of “carbohydrate” as the black monolith of disease, (a TOE for obesity and the DOCS) is not supported by the totality of the evidence so far.

        It’t time to abandon magical beliefs in the power of all so-called “macronutrients” whether fat, carbohydrate or protein.

        Looking forward to further posts.

        TOE = Theory of Everything”

        http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/08/ancestral-health-symposium-drama.html?showComment=1313028098378#c8957908904583605072

      • Paleo as a movement … if there is a graphic artist in the crowd maybe he can photoshop a poster of Richard in a Che Guevara pose.

        If you are results-oriented none of that matters. Paleo or primal or archevore, shoes or no shoes, deodorant or no deodorant, it’s all totally irrelevant.

        How much can you lift, how far and fast can you run, is your testosterone level high enough … that’s what matters. How you get there is no one’s business but your own.

      • Galina L. says:

        I started as a low-carber almost 4 years ago, because by the age 46 I became fat and sick despite trying to eat less and exercise more. I lost initial 20 lb on Atkins and Protein Power, than spend 2 years on a plateau, and was able to move from it by further limiting carbs and embracing some paleo principles like IF. I found LC and Paleo to be the perfect combination because for somebody with well-developed insulin resistance LC is necessary in order to be able to keep reasonable eating intervals and eventually to fast. On another hand, fasting allows to reintroduce some carbs back into one’s diet without getting into slippery slope and became one of individuals on LC sites who do yo-yo thing.. Of course, it would be greatr so start practicing paleo while in a good health, but for people who past a certain point it is often not possible. People with metabolic syndrome usually have an abnormal appetite. LC suppresses it, while calorie counting and intense exercising increases it. Now I look and feel great , much younger than my age thanks to the LC – paleo combination, and calorie counting is not a part of that picture.

      • I think it makes sense to draw a few distinctions.

        – low-carb vs low-carb paleo

        – advocacy vs acceptance

        I think a low to moderate carb paleo is going to be the sweet spot for most people. So that’s what I generally advocate. However, I accept that some may desire or feel better on a medium to high carb paleo diet.

        That said, none of this has anything in the world to do with low carb crap in a box filled with two of the three NADs.

    • low carb isn’t sustainable?

      My goodness, I guess I ought to be morbidly obese or dead instead of a healthy and thin 48. I’ve been low carb for the last 12 years.

      How absurd. Of course it’s sustainable.

  8. Very cool posts Richard. This kind of event gets me all excited about the Paleo/Primal movement. I am fairly certain that this is not a fad and will continue to grow in hte coming years. It is hard to argue with the results that people see when they move away from the SAD. Looking forward to what the 2012 AHS brings.

  9. Tin Tin says:

    “What you should note is the huge percentage of people who look like a human animal should look.”

    Absolutely! I could not agree more. The first thing I noticed in your photos was the extremely high percentage of smokin hot ladies.

  10. Primal toad says:

    Love it. This is so exciting. 2,000 next year? That will happen… No doubt in my mind. I was thinking 3,000. Or more.

  11. Jeremy Shepard says:

    I did not expect to see Tucker Max and Robb Wolf in a picture together from the AHS.

    • I didn’t expect him to be presenting alongside Seth Roberts either, or for Seth to introduce us, or for him to tell me he reads FTA regularly since my Soap/shampoo deal way back when. I emailed him yesterday and got back a long email today with a lot of great tips about my style of blogging & writing.

      He was super nice when I talked with him.

  12. 1000 photos, cut down to 234.
    Facebook Day 1: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.878298765291.2323349.22009713
    Facebook Day 2: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.878306399991.2323352.22009713
    Flickr: – http://www.flickr.com/photos/ajolly/sets/72157627398946770/

    Let me know if anyone needs a photographer :)

    (Crossposted so more people see this!)

    -Jolly

  13. Michael says:

    I wonder how that excessive alcohol consumption goes with Tucker Max’s paleo diet :P

    In all seriousness he did an awesome interview in his unique writing style about paleo concepts, great read.

    http://www.adultswim.com/blog/interviews/celeb-nerdy-tucker-max.html

  14. I’ve been doing a fairly strict Primal/Paleo/LCHF for about 9 months. I am a big guy weighing about 320, (lost about 25 lbs right away and then stopped losing. I feel good, wish I was losing more weight. Here is the deal. I just got a new health plan (Kaiser) did a full blood panel and here are my results:

    Fasting Glucose 108

    CHOLESTEROL 268

    TRIGLYCERIDE 146

    HDL 43

    LDL CALCULATED 196

    CHOLESTEROL/HIGH DENSITY LIPOPROTEIN 6.2

    TSH 1.65

    HGBA1C 5.6

    VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY 87

    VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY, D3 87

    VITAMIN D, 25-HYDROXY, D2 <4

    BUN 17

    SODIUM 140.0

    POTASSIUM 4.3

    CHLORIDE 100.0

    CO2 30.0

    ALT 28

    My new Dr seems very robotic and old school. His nurse left me a vm today suggesting I cut back on sugar (what sugar?!?), fat, and start on simvistatin(sp) 40mg day right away. I don't want to be on a statin. Are these numbers horrible? How do I convincingly talk to him about my numbers and diet choices on my next visit in October? Thanks, I really need your help.

    For more Paleo hacks:

    • As for the cholesterol, you might look here, a post by Paul who also answered your PaleoHacks Q:

      http://perfecthealthdiet.com/?p=2536

      As for the weight loss, and if you are LC, I’d make sure you get over the notion of calories don’t count and you can eat as much as you want. If your loss stopped at 25 pounds, the most likely explanation is that your initial dieting put you in energy deficit and you lost the weight necessary to get back in balance based on your average intake. You will need to keep reducing intake as you lose weight, but what you can do is figure out for yourself what paleo foods give you the most bang for the buck in terms of satiation. Have you tried coconut milk? You also might want to consider fasting 1-2 times per week, 24-30 hours.

      By the way, what would you guess is your normal weight?

  15. Thanks Richard for yor personal response. When I got out of the Navy in ’84, I was 220 with 6% body fat. Had a very physically demanding job. I believe you are right with regard to the amount of food I am eating. One of the appeals of this diet lifestyle was the fact that you didnt have to count calories. I work long days in an office setting. I get in 2-3 short intense and heavy interval workouts with Kettlebells, ropes, pushups, sit ups, etc. Once or twice a month I grapple for an hour or more in Brazilian Jiu jitsu. I am 6’3″, and very strong, (can snatch a 97lb kettlebell from the ground), but i hate being fat. What do you think is my ideal weight?

    • Well I doubt you need to get all the way down to 220, 100 pound loss. But 240-250 seems like a reasonable goal. There are calculators online you can use to estimate what your caloric needs would be based on age, gender, height, weight activity level. You just may end up having to count, but perspective is the most important thing. So, for example:

      http://www.exrx.net/Calculators/CalRequire.html

      Estimating your age at 50 and using 12, 4, 4, 3, 1 for hours of activity.

      @350 = 5979

      @320 = 5588

      @290 = 5196

      @250 = 4675

      @220 = 4285

      The perspective here is that the difference between your starting weight of 350 and a weight in ’84 of 220 is about 1700 calories per day, i.e., almost one entire small person. The difference between where you started and where you are now is 391 calories, and that’s a lot.

      You might want to use fit day for a week or two just to get an idea of how much you are consuming. And if you do decide to count and track, note that you don’t need to go all the way down to 4675 calories. You just want to stay ahead of it as you go, 200-300 calories per day less than your estimated requirements.

Trackbacks

  1. [...] NomNomPaleo (Part 1) (Part 2) Free The Animal (Part 1) (Part 2) (Part 3) (Part 4) Latest In Paleo About.com Low-Carb Diets (Part 1) (more segments coming [...]

  2. [...] fact, Richard Nikoley of Free the Animal fame wrote a post about the beautiful people of the Ancestral Health Symposium. Look! My husband is one of the beautiful people (he’s the [...]

  3. [...] was also able to have dinner with Richard Nikoley at the restaurant Animal. Bea made the comment that we are “so much alike” while we [...]

  4. [...] Riley, Big Think Peter Ballerstedt, Grass Based Health Richard Nikoley, Free the Animal (1) (2) (3) (4) Roger Dickerman Stephan Guyenet, Whole Health Source (1) (2) The Paleo Garden Tony Kenck, Emotions [...]

  5. [...] And perhaps you'll recognize Justine Lam in the video. You may have seen her before. [...]