Resistant Starch is Going Bananas! A Reader Testimonial

Nice Saturday morning email from Alie.

I want to give you a big huge thank you for all the work you do on getting the info on RS out there. It is starting to make a big impact in my life. My husband and I have been eating according to paleo/primal for a couple of years, and have generally been low-carb without trying. I'm not one of those people that tracks fat/carbs/protein, but I know what we're eating so its easy to figure it out. I don't really have weight to lose, but my husband does, so in January, we were like, what the hell, lets do the potato hack, because it couldn't hurt and might help. The good news is that he lost seven pounds in a week, and the bad news is that we realized I'm very sensitive to potatoes. Here's the thing, though. Even with the potato sensitivity, I'm convinced the RS was what we were missing in our diet. I've had improvements in my skin and digestion, and also, hormones seem to be normalizing. He's continued to lose weight and his belly is melting before my eyes. As a side note, doing a restrictive diet like the potato hack is not something I would do again or recommend, but now I'm glad for the info it gave us.

So, in the past couple weeks, I've been researching RS and reading through all the posts on your blog about it. Since potatoes aren't an option right now, I decided to go with green bananas and just this weekend started eating rice again. After just one week, my skin has gone from dry and starting to get wrinkles to feeling incredibly soft and tightening up. Twenty-two year old stretch marks are starting to disappear. I feel incredibly strong and energetic. My husband has continued to lose weight over the past month, but after this week on RS his stomach has shrunk visibly even without further weight loss. We're beginning to see other improvements as well, and time will tell how dramatic those are. I'm hoping to get over this damn potato sensitivity as well since I love potatoes.

I wanted to put this out to you, so that people having trouble with RS will experiment with different types. A problem with potato starch doesn't necessarily mean a problem with RS...could just be the potatoes, as in my case.

Oh, and last night I got carded at the grocery store (I'm 45). And it wasn't a pity-card, either (being a former bartender I can tell the difference). I know I look young, but not that young. So, I came home, looked in the mirror, and realized the improvements in my skin in just a week. Honestly, after that, I'm sold.

Again, thank you. Your perseverance with making sure the info on RS is being presented is improving lives.

Excellent. If the potato starch doesn't work, then try the green bananas eaten fresh or in smoothies, green plantains in smoothies or dehydrated, or the flours that come from both. I use all of these, as well as the Potato Starch. And don't forget to get some of the retrograded RS in your diet via cooked and cooled rice, potatoes, and legumes.

Comments

  1. Ask for cooking bananas in your produce store. They are invariably the greenest of green bananas. Hard to peel though. I also have noticed improvement in skin quality since adding RS.

    • Chipsy says:

      Oh goodness, how very strange!

      I have done LC with going-out-to-dinner-with-friends and try-the-new-bakery cheats for several years. I feel much better on LC than SAD but could only lose weight by actually counting calories.

      Whatever the problem with that, I also had persistent runs. It was not really bothersome but curious. I also had elevated FBG of around 105-110.

      So, and this is oh so strange, I did 2 days of 1/2 T each day of Bob’s Red Mill PS and the runs began to clear up in the morning after the first PS and my FBG the first day after was 98 and today it was 91. I cannot tell you how strange this is.

      I put the PS in a Crystal Lite mix (!) but I might try it with some plain water next. I ordered the Prescript-Assist to try out based on the other comments here. I do not know whether to be concerned that FBG can drop that low that fast or to be elated.

      I did notice what could be an allergic reaction. It could have been something else unrelated or it could be the PS. I will soldier on at the 1/2T and see what else interesting transpires.

      Thank you Richard for being so persistent and prolific on this subject!

  2. Alie, what symptoms did you have that made you realize that you don’t tolerate potato starch?

    • Kath, when we did the potato hack I only lasted 3 of the 5 days we had planned, because I was a sobbing mess in the fetal position on the floor. Only slightly exaggerating. Finally The Hubs made me eat some eggs and I felt better, so of course in true paleo fashion thought it was just the fat I was lacking. But we really liked the potatoes and hadn’t eaten them for awhile and every single time we had them I would get depressed. I am not someone who does that, so it was unusual. Then, what I thought was just dry, itchy skin from winter started to become unbearable. One night, after a plate of potatoes I was going crazy from itching and had a “DOH!” moment. So, we cut out the potatoes and a week later I was itch-free and no longer down emotionally.
      Now, with the RS in the bananas and rice, not only am I not down, but energetic. And not only is my skin not dry, but its so soft I can’t stop touching it.

    • Alie, thanks for your answer. I also had intense itching, only on my torso though. It itched so back it became pain, and I thought I was going to lose my mind. I just couldn’t believe that it was the potato starch, well, I just didn’t want to. I guess I will follow your lead and move on to green bananas. Any tips for making them more palatable?

    • bad, not back.

    • Interesting to read the following comments about latex allergies. Even though I don’t tolerate the potato starch, I have absolutely no allergies. I have never noticed a problem eating real potatoes either, although I don’t eat them often.

    • I would say most of the itching was on the torso, but also arms and hips. I had eliminated everything I could think of and only use expeller pressed virgin coconut oil on my skin, so I knew it wasn’t what I was putting on my skin, but something I was eating. I have no allergies, either, except I caused myself a lavender sensitivity by over using it, so I know it is possible to do that. With potatoes, I also get bloating, but lots of things prior to RS caused that, so I didn’t think much of it. I’m really glad now that we did the potato hack because when I was only eating potatoes and nothing else, it became apparent what the problem was. After awhile I will absolutely eat potatoes again…I’m just giving myself a break right now. I love rice just as much, so at least I’m eating that again.

      Green bananas…I have been making a smoothie in the morning with some coconut milk, a green banana, and some coffee and cinnamon. I like it, but your taste may vary. One of my local Whole Foods stores seems to have caught on to RS because they always put out super green bananas now. I buy a bunch and peel and freeze them just in case I run out, and also because my son is now using them and tends to eat up everything in the house. I also keep some in the fridge. They are super easy to peel if you just do a slice up the side and the banana practically jumps out. I don’t know what you usually eat, but I know later in the summer I will be putting blackberries, blue berries and strawberries in my smoothie. Also, when the hormones get out of hand, a bit of maple syrup keeps me sane.

    • Thanks again for sharing your experiences. I just tried a shake with a green banana, some kefir, blueberries, kale and a bit of pineapple. Had this after a workout, was pretty good. I also got a bunch of green bananas, stuck a few in the frig, peeled and froze the rest. I have no kids at home any more, and I’m sure my husband will stay away from green bananas so I’m lucky there. I love maple syrup too, will try that. I’m 57 years old, so the hormones have settled down and are not an issue, but I’m looking forward to the skin benefits (hope I’m lucky enough to experience that, although I already have pretty good skin, some wrinkles now though).

    • Will cook some rice too, maybe rice pudding for when I get a snack attack.

  3. I think it’s important to get both RS2 and RS3. For RS2, green bananas and raw potato starch are probably the only two real options most of us have. The RS3 is easier–rice, beans, potatoes in a cooked/cooled/reheated or eaten cold manner.

    Just going out on a limb here, but I think eating PHD style, with a focus on cooked/cooled, and then a really green banana a day is probably all anyone needs. Especially if taken alongside some good probiotics and fermented foods.

    I wish there were more options for RS2. Other potential candidates are mung beans starch, tapioca starch, and whole grains, but for a known potency and proven, well-studied effects those other sources just don’t quite match up to potato starch and green bananas.

    Maybe one day more will be known and we’ll have other options. Thanks for your report on the banana results. Green bananas have some fascinating properties aside from RS as well, and may even be a better long-term choice than potato starch.

    • Tator:

      Does home brewed kombucha count?

    • I’ve been taking 50 grams of RS for almost 2 months now. I notice the days I lose the most weight are when I also have beans and lentils.

    • @tatertot

      Is RS1 such as in nuts and seeds somehow less valuable to the gut than RS2 and RS3? I ask because some of the reactions people have posted such as itching etc be related to latex allergy which is fairly common. Cross-reactive foods to latex allergy include banana, potato, avocado and others. Legumes can trigger/worsen autoimmunity for some folks so for them and those with latex allergy, do you think the resistant starch in RS1 nuts/seeds become more important — in other words, getting some in whatever way you can combined with fermented veggies/probiotics?

      Also, have you had any experience using cashews as your resistant starch source? The charts provided in one of the links showed impressive amounts in cashews (didn’t say whether raw or roasted) and one study indicated that cashews and lotus root provided the greatest amounts of RS in the Chinese diet — not rice, surprisingly.

      Anyway, keep up the great work.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Adrienne, the point of the potato starch is to obtain RS without consuming tons of other calories. The latex cross-reactivity for potatoes (protein) is moderate. How much latex would be present in potato starch which has been washed prior to drying?

      I would figure that someone who reacts to potato starch would be in big trouble in life, generally. They’d be reacting to all sorts of stuff. http://latexallergyresources.org/cross-reactive-food

      Cashews can be allergenic as well. What is the amount of resistant starch in this as in grams/calories? Even though the latex in cashew is in the fruit and not the part we consume as a nut, which it isn’t, anyone that sensitive to latex would be well advised to avoid cashew as well due to contamination.

    • @Gabriella, here’s the study link — that has list of foods and rs content content in Chinese diet —

      http://apjcn.nhri.org.tw/server/APJCN/19/2/274.pdf

      There’s almost 13 grams of RS per 100 grams of raw cashews.

      I do have a latex sensitivity and can tolerate small amounts of kiwi and generally ok with avocado so long as it’s ripe and I don’t eat them day after day. I’m not a banana lover and haven’t eaten one in well over a decade so I’m not sure how I’d react. I have had reactions to cashews but feel it may be the sourcing differences. There is one raw source I like that is from Brazil and I can eat them without problems. The problems are generally skin related — redness of face, sores on oral tissue/mouth, itching and sometimes nausea. Latex bandages give me a red bumpy rash so I only use latex free, and only latex free gloves for work. The allergists have told me that cross-reactivity is not always consistent or predictable. I just happened to notice that banana and potato may cause issues in people with latex allergies or sensitivities — not necessarily, just maybe.

      Cashews are calorie rich at 160 per ounce according to the bag I just bought. Unlike tree nuts such as almonds or hazelnuts, the isn’t much fiber and no skins so the calories are likely more available. I didn’t realize calories were necessarily an issue with respect to selecting RS, but you bring up a good point. If calories are an issue, one could simply make cuts elsewhere or select other sources of RS that are less caloric. The cashews appeal to me because they taste great and are portable.

    • Adrienne – Here’s the thing with RS1. Once it’s out of it’s shell, it’s RS2. RS1 isn’t digested or fermented by anything, it’s ‘physically inaccessible’ by definition. If you put a piece of bread inside a plastic bubble, you’d have created RS1.

      Cashews are probably a decent source of RS2, but at quite a high caloric load. If there was a way to get cashew starch or lotus root starch, I’d be all over it. There are probably sources of RS, especially in Asian cooking, that we have been overlooking. Sago palm for one.

    • DuckDodgers says:

      If there was a way to get cashew starch or lotus root starch

      But tatertot, they sell everything on Amazon. :)

      http://amzn.com/B00BYO9RL4

    • BrazilBrad says:

      “There’s almost 13 grams of RS per 100 grams of raw cashews.”

      Wow, very cool. Didn’t know. Calories? meh! Anyway cashews are very satiating at least to me even if highly paletable. If I eat too much they wreak havoc on my gut so for me they are kinda self limiting.

    • @BrazilBrad,

      There might be more happy news for you – roasted and salted in shell pistachios tested at approximately 22 grams per 100 grams of pistachios. Fried chestnuts with sugar tested at approximately 17 grams per 100 grams and peanuts prepared either by roasting, frying or boiling provided approximately 15 grams per serving. It would be interesting to learn if raw pistachios (as I prefer them) would contain more rs than roasted in shell and if roasted chestnuts contain as much rs as fried.

      I am beginning to think that some low carbers and/or paleos may have inadvertantly cut out lots of rs sources that don’t wreak havoc with blood glucose because of fear of omega-6. Also, many stopped eating all nuts except for macadamias because they contain virtually no carbs or omega 6. Others were convinced that legumes were akin to poison. So the starchier nuts like pistachios and legumes such as cashews and peanuts were off the table. Macs are wonderful, however, the lack of carbs in certain nuts means lack of starch so not a good choice if one wants to eat at least some rs without resorting to beans/potatos. While I agree that there appears to be convincing evidence that high omega 6 oils may be problematic — I now think it’s a huge mistake to throw the baby out with the bathwater and extrapolate this to avoiding tree nuts that contain omega 6. I don’t believe there is convincing evidence that phytic acid in nuts is problematic whatsoever when nuts are eaten as part of a varied diet and not relied upon as the sole source of protein.

    • Adrienne

      You win the internet for me, today.

      Excellent. I essentially did the same thing, eschew instead of chew nuts, and I ate nuts almost every day as I initially lost the 60 pounds on Paleo. Hmmm.

      What got me to stop eating nuts (except macs — see Fat Bread: http://freetheanimal.com/2012/07/fat-bread-third-times-the-charm-mission-accomplished.html ) was the concentrated use in baking stuff, especially almond meal/four)

      So now I’m thinking maybe I went overboard. And here’s the kicker. One of my fav TV watching things was Fage yogurt with a half handful of mixed nuts tossed on top, i.e., RS and probiotic combo.

      Full circle?

      But, I will never use the meals/flours again. Nuts should be chewed, and if you really want to get Paleo, get the bags of nuts you used to see at holiday celebrations still in the shell, where you had to crack them to eat them.

    • As soon as you crack a nut open the n-6 starts to oxidize…so the quicker you can get it from shell to mouth the better…sometimes convenience is not optimal.

      When I was a kid, my grandparents had a quite large Black Walnut tree in their yard. On holiday visits, my cousins and I would spend hours sitting in the tree eating fresh walnuts. Those were the days…

    • @Charlie — I don’t think we’re that delicate. If a nut is rancid, you taste that immediately and spit it out. Many nuts also have a skin like hazelnuts or almonds that offer additional protection. It’s true that fungus, mold can grow on the skins of shelled nuts but it’s usually visible as black blotches. If not, a bite into a moldy nut is pretty obvious taste wise. There are also polyphenols and antioxidants and likely other things in nuts that help protect the oils. Humans have enjoyed nuts for thousands of years — and long before refrigeration — so if they were that “dangerous,” show me the bodies.

      Also, what about the admittedly smaller amounts of omega 6 in poultry, meat, eggs, olive oil, etc — wouldn’t they start to oxidize immediately too? And then we make matters worse by heating them.

      Omega-3 fats are even more delicate than Omega-6 and most of the world eats it without being able to catch and eat it raw within minutes. Unless one hunts daily, most of our meat has been in storage for weeks-months, yet we still eat it.

      Optimal isn’t optimal if it’s impossible.

      As for fresh walnuts off the tree — that would be wonderful but again, not possible for most of us.

    • @Richard — I’m with you on the meals/flours and would add nut butters to that list as well.

      Best to eat them organic, whole and raw (if you tolerate) or gently toasted at home on low heat. I’m not buying all the need to sprout etc. Too much work unless you have weak digestion or have a phytic acid phobia.

      Re the Fage and nuts — buon appetito!

    • DuckDodgers says:

      I agree that nuts in moderation are a great addition to a varied diet. But in terms of evolutionary history, (for those who give a fuck, and not that anyone really cares at this point) I don’t see how most nuts were widely consumed before hybridization and domestication. Most wild nuts were/are very poisonous and highly toxic.

      If it weren’t for domestication, there would be very few nuts that humans would be able to tolerate.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Duckie, hickory nuts.

    • I’m with you Gab. I think nuts were probably a huge seasonal source of calories for any HG group living where nuts grow. In N. America, wild hickory nuts, black walnuts, acorns, and beechnuts grow now as they always have, and are easily collected, shelled, and eaten. When I was a kid, we’d find Indian artifacts of nut cracking tools in Ohio. Basically just a big flat rock with a divot chipped out to hold the nut while they smashed them with another rock. My brother and I would collect hickory nuts, shell them, and sell them. There were also guys who collected hickory nuts and squeezed the oil out of them and sold hickory nut oil.

      I can’t imagine the same wasn’t done with macadamia nuts, pistachios, and others.

    • DuckDodgers says:

      Heh. Well, I said most nuts were poisonous. I didn’t say all. I’m sure you guys can rattle off a handful of safe nuts, but they are a minority of what is found in the wild.

      Tatertot, wild black oak acorns (the ones harvested by the California Native Americans) are poisonous unless properly soaked for long periods of time:

      After two days spent with the Miwok tribe of Tuolumne County, I learned that the tribe prefers the acorn from the Black Oak (Quercus kelloggii). They are plentiful, nutritious and taste sweet after processing.

      During our meetings I experienced the making of “Acorn.” The preparing of “Acorn” is a very reverent event. It must be done the right way, the old way. This way is taught verbally to each generation…The acorns are gathered by each family, and each has its favorite tree. The processing is not done quickly as there are several steps to complete. Acorns contain a substance called gallotannin, which is poisonous, and must be removed before eating. The first step is to crack the acorn outer shell, then peel off the red skin covering the inner seed. Next, they grind the acorn into a fine flour and then rinse the flour many times for 24 hours (until the rinse water is clear) to remove the brownish tannin. [link]

      Failure to remove the toxic gallotannin causes, “ulceration of the mouth, esophagus, and gastrointestinal tract”. Not fun.

      As for nuts that are safe to eat raw, they are a minority. It depends on the nut. Sure, pecans, chestnuts, hickory, were edible in their raw states.

      But wild almonds? No way. Wild almonds are highly poisonous. — they contain glycoside amygdalin that turns into deadly prussic acid (hydrogen cyanide) when you chew them or crush the nut.

      Wild Macadamias? Only 3 of the 16 species of wild Macadamias can be safely eaten — and of those 3, only 2 can safely be eaten raw. The rest are poisonous.

      Wild cashews? Nope. Cashew shells contain an allergenic phenolic resin, a potent skin irritant similar to urushiol which is also a toxin found in the related poison ivy. Roasting cashews destroys the toxin, but the oil becomes airborne and can cause severe, life-threatening, reactions to the lungs.

      Pistachios have some allergenic properties that affect people who are particularly sensitive to cashew urushiols.

      Raw nutmeg, in large quantities, has intense psychoactive effects. Nutmeg contains myristicin and myristicin poisoning can induce “convulsions, palpitations, nausea, eventual dehydration, generalized body pain, nausea and dizziness, dry mouth, bloodshot eyes and memory disturbances.” The effects of Nutmeg poisoning can last for several days.

      That’s just what happens with most nuts. They are pretty toxic and tend to have strong allergens and toxins. But, can you find a few wild species that are safe to eat raw? Sure. Absolutely. There just aren’t many.

    • DD – Touche’

    • DuckDodgers says:

      :) Yeah… But, I don’t think that should discourage anyone from eating nuts. They make a great snack! And I can say with confidence that the minority of nuts that were safe to eat raw (pecans, walnuts, for instance) were obviously exploited by the cultures that had access to them.

    • Same here. I am noticing a slimming down effect after adding in Anasazi beans and sprouted lentils.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Duckie, in the Central Asian countries where apricots are grown (Oh god I miss ripe Hungarian apricots right off the tree! Heaven on earth!) people also crack the pits and remove the seed for consumption. It’s not poisonous.

      Koreans also use acorn flour. I think though that in most cultures, acorn was a starvation food. It was the last thing left when nothing else was available.

      Italians used chestnut flour also when nothing else was to be found. I suppose for the gluten intolerant or celiacs, chestnut flour may be a good addition to the strange things mixed in to make ‘bread’. Safer than almond flour which is super high in oxalates. Which, if ya don’t got the bugs, you get trouble. One of my buddies just discovered this. Ouch. Kidney problems now.

  4. If you can’t handle the potato hack, the macrobiotic brown rice hack may do the same:

    In the macrobiotic diet, a lot is made of brown rice. There are lots of stories of people eating ONLY brown rice (no salt, etc) for several weeks and dropping a lot of weight. Also, they don’t just eat brown rice; they chew each bite 50 times.

    I’ve noticed whenever I chew my food slowly, I feel full faster I guess it takes the body a while to realize it is full, if you are eating fast it is easy to miss the signal. When you chew slowly, you get the warning right on time.

    So, if you can’t handle potatoes, macrobiotic brown rice may be an option, especially if you let it cool, for the RS.

    • I did the brown rice hack in the early 70s for about six months–90% brown rice, 10% vegetables and chewed everything 50 times. I lost 50 lbs., looked like I just got out of a concentration camp, and started to have cavities for the first time in my life at age 20. Maybe I shouldn’t have done it for so long, ya think?

    • http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17127465

      Blood glucose lowering effects of brown rice in normal and diabetic subjects.
      Panlasigui LN1, Thompson LU.
      Author information
      Abstract
      Carbohydrate foods, which produce low glycemic responses, have been shown to be beneficial in the dietary management of chronic diseases such as diabetes and hyperlipidemia. This study determined the starch digestion rate in vitro and, in a randomised crossover design, the postprandial blood glucose response of 10 healthy and nine type 2 diabetic volunteers to brown rice compared to milled rice from the same batch and variety. The total sugar released in vitro was 23.7% lower in brown rice than in milled rice. In healthy volunteers, the glycemic area and glycemic index were, respectively, 19.8% and 12.1% lower (p < 0.05) in brown rice than milled rice, while in diabetics, the respective values were 35.2% and 35.6% lower. The effect was partly due to the higher amounts of phytic acid, polyphenols, dietary fiber and oil in brown compared to milled rice and the difference in some physicochemical properties of the rice samples such as minimum cooking time and degree of gelatinisation. In conclusion, brown rice is a more health beneficial food for diabetics and hyperglycemic individuals than milled rice.

    • kayumochi says:

      Like Charles, I was once in Macrobiotic circles and do not recommend organic brown rice eaten the way Macrobiotic pioneers like Michio Kushi recommended, especially men. Like Charles, you will look like you escaped from a concentration camp. Kushi’s wife, Aveline, died of ovarian cancer some years back. Organic brown rice isn’t the miracle it is made out to be.

    • kayumochi says:

      Want to add that I damaged by gut eating organic brown rice Macrobiotic-style (see below). It may be fine in small amounts now and then but I have seen little good come from that food movement. Had the internet been around when Macrobiotics was in its heyday (before my time) the movement would have fallen apart rather quickly and the assumption that brown rice is a *healthy* food would not burden us today.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Charles, just even from a dental perspective, potatoes don’t cause dental caries.

      Brown rice, even in rice producing communities, is only eaten immediately after harvest. The bran oil gets rancid quickly, which is why rice is milled. I could never understand the brown rice appeal here in north America. Nowadays rice can be found that is packaged vacuum sealed, so maybe that’s better.

    • kayumochi says:

      The appeal of brown rice in North American can be traced directly to Macrobiotics which influenced the post WW2 natural foods industry greatly.

    • kayumochi says:

      Macrobiotic devotees often have dental caries and generally bad looking teeth and gums.

    • I’m not saying potatoes caused caries. As far as I’m concerned, I got dental caries for the first time in my life because I was seriously malnourished for six months and it ruined the protective health of my teeth. This was after 20 years of perfect teeth, no cavities, mostly eating while I was growing up a lot of sugar (Spoonfuls right out of the container), sodas, etc., and paying no attention to my teeth or gums–hardly ever brushing, etc. But I also drank a half-gallon of milk a day, ate a lot of meat and fish. The caries started showing up a year or two after I got off the macrobiotic diet.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Charles, I didn’t imply you made a claim that potatoes cause dental caries. I just suggested potatoes as opposed to rice. All the grains are cariogenic. For some reason potatoes and sweet potatoes are not.

    • Sorry, GK. I didn’t catch that–makes sense now that you’ve clarified. I tried the potato hack. Did it for four days and could barely move my joints were so sore. I felt like an old guy all of a sudden. Stopped the potatoes and was back to my old semi-agile self in a couple of days. While I agree the poison is in the dose, clearly my body doesn’t like potatoes much. Potato starch, on the other hand, it likes just fine. And I’m good with cooked and cooled parboiled rice (with bacon and sardines, for example). So I think I’m going to stay away from potatoes. But that’s obviously individual. And thanks for clarifying.

    • But I would also make the argument that no food is particularly cariogenic unless the integrity of the teeth has been compromised. I may only be an N=1 on that, but it’s rather convincing to me.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Okay Charles. I won’t debate a lawyer. ;)

    • Well I ain’t a lawyer, but I don’t want to debate you either. I have great respect for your opinions/knowledge. Let’s just say that grains and sugars and candy and soda and potatoes and not brushing or flossing hardly ever weren’t cariogenic for moi for twenty years of my life until I malnourished myself almost to death. I will not generalize to any other person’s mouth.

    • I can attest to that. I became a heavy wheat, oat and rice consumer in the mid 80s when the anti-cholesterol/low-fat dogma started in full swing and I didn’t stop until about 6+ years ago – I also ate 4 0r 5 servings of fruit a day, and my teeth went to hell.

  5. randomnav says:

    I am going to go down the green banana route. After 12-24 hours after ingesting potato starch, my lips would get inflamed and I started getting tiny little puss filled sacs on my lips. It was painful and not a good look! I have had it previously when I use a lip balm with peppermint or when I have had water with lemon. I presume this is because peppermint and lemon can be irritants to the skin but I have no idea why PS was also causing this (I can eat potatoes with no problem).

    I know it was PS for sure as I have stopped and started PS 4-5 times over the last 2 months and each time I start, this symptom comes up the next day and eases once I stop the PS.

    I have also ordered some Tapioca starch to see how I get along with that.

    Also, I read that if you separate the bunch of bananas and keep them in the fridge, it slows the ripening process.

  6. Alie, I’m sensitive to potatoes too.
    I manage a “Spanish Caravan Special” (i.e. PS via a retention enema) once a week without any problems, in fact those days are the ones followed by the best sleep!
    Other days I’m using green bananas or green banana flour.
    Here’s something interesting though. I’ve only been using RS2 a few weeks but my sensitivity to cooked, or cooked and cooled whole potatoes has diminished significantly in that time. The joint pain I used to get seems 75% less than it was a month ago. This makes me wonder if the problem I have with potatoes is to do with some deficiency I had in my gut flora, instead of the “nightshade intolerance” my doctor suggested it was.

  7. kayumochi says:

    Back in the late 1980′s when I was just a dumb kid chewing Macrobiotic brown rice (see above) I developed a chronic crack on the right side of my mouth. Had it off and on (mostly on) until a year or so ago when I began adding the PHD-recommended supplements one by one. The zinc cleared it up like nothing else but for the healing to hold I had to take much, much more than the PHD recommends (and even then it came back occasionally) which got me to wondering about my gut health. Adding PS in addition to the zinc kept the crack at bay for even longer periods of time and then I knew I was on to something. Adding the Prescript Assist seems to have sealed the deal – the crack has been perfectly healed since beginning the pro/prebiotic + PS + zinc. I can now safely cut back on the zinc supplement :)

    • Which pre-biotics are you taking?

      And yes, I think 6 months was too long. In the Macrobiotic book I read, the author described how he did the brown rice for 20 days while in prison. So, 20 days (or even 5 days) at a time is probably ok.

      Although, I’d really love to get some soylent that has the fats and carbs taken out; then I could do whatever I wanted for carbs and fats, and still know I’m getting all the OTHER stuff my body needs. I’m just really disappointed that soylent decided to use canola oil, instead of olive oil like he used in the original soylent recipe.

      With soylent to fill in the gaps, we have a safety for experimenting with the effects of various diets and macro-nutrient ratios. Or rather, we would, if we could get it with just the micronutrients, and the macros taken out.

    • Why not just get baby formula instead of Soylent?

    • Seriously??? You would KNOW , really know, that you would be getting
      All the other stuff your body needs??? What about all the still unknown cofactors
      in actual food?

      And who says it was the brown rice that helped that guy in prison? Maybe it was just that he was on a modified fast? Chewing thoroughly can’t hurt though.

      I did macrobiotics twice. Once in the seventies and once in the early nineties. How dumb was that? What was good about it both times was the crap I was not eating anymore. And I was thrilled to lose weight, but did not realize it was not a healthy weight loss. Also, the second time I did it I gained back the weight in the second year of the diet.

      Thank Dog we have the internet now to get a quick read on the downside of some of these things.

      Anyway, as far as macrobiotics! what I really want to say is fuck macrobiotics.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Richard, the baby formula with iron and galacto oligosaccharides added. I think there’s one advertising omega 3 as well.

      Don’t know how the price point would match between that and Soylent (which is still apparently not ready for shipping after crowdsourcing what? 2 million dollars?)

    • gabriella kadar says:

      kayumochi, perleche is the name of what you have/had. It’s caused by candida. Sort of like having diaper rash of the mouth. When saliva chronically keeps a wound like that moist all the time, it feeds the candida.

      Usually a cream for candida will clear it up. When it’s well established, you’d need both an antibacterial and antifungal creams. And then watch if the corners of your mouth are hanging down due to lack of support by teeth or aging face… less collagen. Some foods can make things worse. Acidic fruits like pineapple. Chlorine in swimming pools.

      Zinc and iron sufficiency generally keep candida from causing trouble, but environmental factors play a big role.

    • “which is still apparently not ready for shipping after crowdsourcing what? 2 million dollars?”

      There’s a book in this and a bunch of these other crowdsourcing deals (don’t get me wrong though, I’d rather fools and their money be soon parted, and I really like that people do that—just do it voluntarily).

      Proposed title: “The Moron of Crowds.”

    • gabriella kadar says:

      …………chuckle

    • Gabs:

      OK, now that you told kayo all that, please tell me.

      As a kid, either caused by nothing I was aware of of any time or I bit my lip or the inside of my cheek, I would get canker sores. hue ones, with bright red rings. Sometimes the pain was so intense I would go to a water fountain and just run cool water on it.

      One time, it was so bad, so big my mom took me too the doc and he cauterized it with a match stick kinda thing. Later, in mid-20s and on exchange with the French Navy I suddenly began developing warts on my fingers, but mostly thumbs. They gave me this stick (silver nitrate?). Anyway, it worked. Wet the wart, rub that in, feel the burn, but in a few days it’s dead.

      Then I connected dots. Without even checking, I presumed it was the same thing the doc burnt my canker sore with way back so the next time I got one, I just pulled my lip back, and applied the stick. After the burn, instant relief.

      I haven’t had one in a decade or more, nor a wart. Even if I stupidly really bite my lip and it was 100% until I was maybe 30-35.

      What’s going on?

    • I want a paleo version of soylent. Or at least a PHD version of soylent. I looked into going on Ensure, but the cost is prohibitive. Also, that stuff is addicitive.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Those kinds of canker sores from trauma are initially infected by bacteria. The nerve endings are right there on the surface, so they are intensely painful. If they don’t heal, the tissue becomes oxygen starved and candida secondarily infects them. When left long enough, they can look very ugly.

      Cauterization works because it burns the nerve endings. Putting extremely salty solution or salt crystals directly on the canker sore will accomplish the same thing.

      These things heal on their own for healthy people, it just takes time and can be painful which is why cauterizing is not a bad idea. Using warm salt water rinsing multiple times per day will help heal them faster because swishing the salt water around will debride the wound. ( I give this advice and ended up only taking it when a sore behind my last bottom molar would keep reminding me that it was there. I swear it was there for about 10 days before I took the trouble to check in the mirror. Eeejit. Started the salt water and it went away.)

      Warts are viral. One of my friends showed me a couple of warts on her hand. Said how did I get these? I told her, it’s your right hand. Do you ever shake hands with people? Yup……..there you go.

      But even wart virus won’t get a toe hold, so to speak, unless there is a break in the skin. That’s why some people get plantar warts from crappy swimming pool surrounds. Once in, the wart establishes itself. Warts will stimulate skin cells to create a thick barrier between themselves and the immune system. The body doesn’t know they are there.

      If you want a wart to go away and prime the immune system to recognize the virus before it gets a chance to establish during future exposures, the body needs to be exposed to the virus. Sanding a wart until bleeding happens will accomplish this.

      Or just don’t shake hands.

    • Richard, canker sores are sometimes the only symptom of celiac disease. I got canker sores for most of my life, and if I bit my lip badly I could count on getting one. Since cutting out gluten I hardly ever get them. I would bet that even if someone doesn’t have celiac, a gluten sensitivity could manifest as canker sores.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Annika, haven’t noticed. Maybe if someone has celiac and doesn’t know it, then malabsorption of nutrients would delay healing.

    • kayumochi says:

      No, I am familiar with perleche and that is not what I had. No creams/medicines or changes in diet helped. Remember I had it from 1987 up through 2013 and I tried everything.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      kayu, it must have been extraordinarily uncomfortable and annoying. I got one from a rough hygienist. Then it wouldn’t heal because of the swimming pool chlorine. Took months. Cream would help but improvement wouldn’t last. Environmental factors prevented healing.

    • Cost? Enough baby formula for an adult male, wouldn’t be much a savings over using Ensure. And that stuff is spendy.

    • Yea, but depends on whether you use supplementally, or as a common or complete meal replacement.

    • Kayumochi

      I love hearing that! Good job. Thanks for jumping on the gut health bandwagon. Our gut microbiota regulate everything, no?

      How can potato starch or green bananas feed an empty zoo that has been eradicated by either VLC or antibiotics???!

    • Canker sores were accepted as part of life growing up fifty years ago. My ex-wife’s extended, local family had a little bottle of carbolic acid. Someone would get a sore, and the question became, “Who’s got the acid bottle?” It would be located, and used. It was just a glass rod attached to the cap, pull it out, and transfer the acid to the sore.

      IIRC, you only needed to do that once.

      I’ve not had a canker sore in decades, haven’t a clue why that is. Certainly lots of diet and lifestyles along the road.

  8. Potato hack is meant to be a temporary intervention; I believe the brown rice diet was also meant as an intervention, not a lifestyle. The phytates in brown rice are wicked.

  9. I apparently have a sensitivity to the digestible carbs in potatoes, rice, beans, or whatever. Yesterday was the last day of a 30-day trial of beans and rice. To my complete disgust I gained 12 pounds of fat. (I did have a clue of course; my jeans are currently rather uncomfortably tight.) The cold potato hack a few months ago resulted in a four-pound gain in about a week. The really odd thing, to me, is my blood glucose would not rise very much postprandial to which I attribute the potato starch I’ve been ingesting for many months.

    I’ve decided high-carb foods, regardless of their “glycemic load” or their resistant starch potential, just aren’t for me so I’ve made a dreadful decision. Yesterday I purchased an armful of vegetables and though I really-really don’t like rabbit food, I’ve committed myself to eating vast amounts of the stuff. My gut bugs had best start building monuments, creating holidays, and generally treating me like a god given this rather drastic undertaking.

    • James H:

      First, sorry for the setback. Must hurt.

      Second, thanks for taking one for the team in demonstrating that we are, indeed, not all alike. Fortunately the potato hack and RS seems to work well for most and trust me that I dearly want it to work for everyone.

    • James,

      I am not clear from what you say whether you are going to continue the potato starch while cutting out all the high carb foods or discontinue that too?

    • The thing about vegetables is you really have to eat a lot of them to avoid starving yourself, like 7-8 pounds a day. And even then you’re not quite satisfied, just really full of fiber. It isn’t bad for the first few weeks but eventually it gets to be a chore. I crack after six weeks or so.

      This is why vegans tend to cheat with highly processed foods, eating vegetables gets to be like a job.

      Also you fart like a farm animal, and it’s best to keep a plunger in the bathroom just in case.

    • Ellen,

      Yes, indeed, I will continue the potato starch. It does work for me since it is all resistant starch, except for the minor amount of water included in its structure.

    • rob,

      I failed in clarity; I continue to eat animal fats and proteins. In no way am I vegetarian or, worse, a vegan. (Most vegans I’ve read or met treat veganism as a religion; I can’t stand that type of closed-minded dedication to a subject or course of action.)

      You are correct about the fartage. I ate my first large load of vegetables last night for supper, along with a steak topped with a bit of herbed butter, and this afternoon the jet-engine effect has started again, though not as energetic as when I started with the potato starch.

    • Richard,

      Nah, it doesn’t hurt but it is a pisser. Being fat all one’s life, with the ups and downs, a gain of 12 pounds is a trifle.

    • So the reason for the armful of vegetables is the fiber?

      Are you eating them all raw?

    • James, supplemental digestive enzymes may help if you want to keep stuff like rice and beans in your diet. My kids — well, only one now — take Carbgest enzymes with carby stuff (specifically foods that are not allowed on the GAPS Diet/SCD, like potatoes, rice, sweet potatoes, etc).

      Big thanks to Richard and Tim. I think the potato starch is what helped push my other kid over the edge into digestion good enough that I was able to successfully stop the enzymes for him. Yay! My older isn’t there yet but the potato starch looks to be a helpful part of an improving trajectory for her digestion.

    • Ellen,

      Yes, the reason for the vegetables is the fermentable fiber. Since potatoes, rice, and legumes apparently do me more harm than good, I figure veggies are the way to go.

      Besides, there are the benefits as described by the now famous Dr. Terry Wahl who claims bucketsful of rabbit food put her MS into remission.

    • Tanya,

      I hadn’t tried supplemental enzymes but I’m not worried about it anyway. I do like beans–pinto, kidney, navy, etc.–but the loss isn’t a heartbreaker for me. The reason I was trying the rice and legumes was just as a different source of resistant starch. I do like lots of butter and sour cream flavored with a bit of baked potato but even before having gone primal/paleo, I didn’t eat that much potato anyway so no big loss.

      I am currently supplementing with a variety of gut bugs using three sources: the Primal Flora from Mark Sisson, some from GutFlora that offers a few more species beyond Sisson’s, and another from Prescript-Assist offering something like 25 or 30 separate “soil-based organisms” beyond the first two. The three supplements offer a very wide assortment of species of gut bugs way over the typical supplementation. I plan to stick with this protocol for several months then back off to see what happens.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      James, did you ADD all the new foods to ALL of your old regular foods? Because then, yes, you’d gain weight. If you check the plating at PHD, you can get an idea of what dinner is like on a 2,000 kcal diet. If you were putting more than that on a plate, then it’s not really surprising if you gained weight.

      Paul Jaminet did a guest blog about what he does in a typical day and what he eats and how much he eats. I was very surprised at how little food = 2,000 kcal.

    • James,

      I completely agree with you on the benefits and hope you can find some ways of preparing them that you will enjoy. There are so many possibilities, I find it difficult to imagine you would dislike them all!

    • gabriella kadar,

      Negative, I stopped eating some foods, replacing them with the legumes and/or rice. 1 cup beans or rice replaced, say, a bread-less cheeseburger or I would add 1/2-cup rice along side a reduced portion of a cauliflower casserole. Sometimes I would eat 1/2-cup beans mixed with 1/4-cup rice for lunch. I ate at least one meal per day using legumes and/or rice. Occasionally I would eat two reduced portions in a day.

      I do not count calories–I got away from that obsession–but I am confident my caloric intake was the same.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      James, maybe you absorb the calories from these foods more efficiently.

      I take 2 tablespoons PS once per day mixed in the least amount of yoghurt that results in a smooth paste. That’s my usual. I don’t go to 4 tablespoons. I don’t eat beans. Have not for decades. I think everyone needs to find their personal comfort zone and determine what works for them. I eat corn tortillas and rice. Wheat and barley products bloat. Can increase waist measurement by 4 inches. Wheat plus beans = dirigible time. Suffocation in usual clothing.

      The first month into PS it seemed I’d gained weight. Clothing got tighter. It seems things are getting better because I went shopping on Friday and can almost fit into 1 size smaller than my usual pre PS. But nowadays, instead of eating breakfast and a large supper, I eat breakfast, small lunch, small supper and the potato starch. Sometimes in the evening I’m not hungry, so I make a potato starch/banana/yoghurt/milk smoothie, that’s about all I can eat for supper. On those days calorie intake is definitely down.

      But I am not trying to control type 2 diabetes. My guts don’t talk or yell at me. Hemoglobin is high, ferritin is mid range, so I know minerals are being absorbed well. I wouldn’t dare take an iron supp.

      Take magnesium in coconut water, or a pill or Epsom salt bath. I think that might be the only thing the diet is not addressing adequately. I find that drinking 500ml coconut water helps to ease my back pain a bit. So probably I don’t drink enough fluids at work. Dehydration is painful.

    • gabriella kadar,

      You basically explained my situation; I believe I am quite efficient, unfortunately, at absorbing calories from certain foods. I do take potato starch early in the morning and late in the evening, 2 tbls per dose in a pint of milk kefir. All the N=1 experiments I’ve performed over the last couple of years, culminating with the experiment of the last 30 days, has convinced me I will just have to avoid, most of the time, legumes, rice, potatoes, tortillas, etc.

      Feh…win some, lose some.

      “Wheat plus beans = dirigible time.” Funny.

    • Ellen,

      Yepper, I get that a lot. Many people can’t believe I am anti-rabbit food but it’s true; I really don’t like vegetables. I don’t like the flavor or the texture or the smell or whatever. Never have.

      I am eating about half the veggies raw and the other half in a hot broth much as they do in the Orient. I fill a large bowl with as many vegetables as it will hold and fill the bowl with a hot beef or chicken broth (scratch-made of course). The greens are slightly wilted without turning them into wet Kleenex and the broth cools to eating temperature immediately. I will usually add a handful of whole garlic cloves to the heating broth until they are hot through but without actually cooking them.

      One has been told for many years that if one continues eating a given unpalatable food, that food will eventually become a favorite. We shall see.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      James, a pint of kefir is a LOT! Why can’t you just mix the PS in the minimum volume it will absorb? 4 ounces. 6 ounces, max? I’m only mixing the 2 tablespoons of PS in 2 tablespoons of live culture yoghurt. Volume. I wouldn’t be able to eat a darn thing for supper if I would consume a pint of kefir. I have kefir here too but consume maybe 6 ounces max per day. (I let my office manager free base it because there’s way too much of it.)

    • “I do like lots of butter and sour cream flavored with a bit of baked potato”

      Funny man is in the House!

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Richard, I suspect the origin of the 12 pounds.

    • “a pint of kefir is a LOT!

      Yep, now it’s 2-3 OZ of kefir, 2-3 OZ of whatever Odwalla-esque fruit or green smoothy I like. Takes about 2 weeks to get through a quart of both.

      Sometimes I mix in whatever fruit I have on hand.

    • “Richard, I suspect the origin of the 12 pounds.”

      Yea, I’m that kinda guy, for sure. But recently we were at a resto and I ordered a BP. Asked for all the helpings on the side. Maybe a tsp each of butter and sour cream, with some bacon bits and then unlimited green onions.

      I remarked to Bea: “Wow, a baked potato actually tastes good.” Probably the 1st time I’d ever tasted one.

    • Maybe if you cooked them more than that ….. I find that most greens require more cooking than is currently fashionable to make them taste good to me. Often I will lightly sautéed some onions , add the chopped rinsed greens and steam/ sauté a bit more, then add broth and seasonings and cook really well, till tender, then purée with an immersion blender and then add some lemon juice or an interesting vinegar. This works well to make in a batch that will last for several days. Also adding some kind of fermented cream would be tasty. but probably too many extra calories. You could also play around with herbs spices…..smoked paprika???

      One of my favorite raw veg dishes is carrots shredded in the food processor and tossed with salt, fresh lemon juice and some good olive oil. It is amazing how much better this is than just a carrot stick. This will keep in the fridge for a while too. It is good as is but You could toss in some sauerkraut or other fermented veg, or a bunch of chopped green herbs like parsley, scallions , dill or cilantro.

      Using those green herbs by the handful rather than the pinch in all kind of recipes is another way to get the benefits of greens and might be more appealing Think Mexican salsas….

      there are plenty of ways to change the flavor, texture and taste…..
      You are not going to keep eating them if you don’t like them so it would be worth your time to experiment with recipes I would think….

      Oh!! And here is a recent discovery that I love…jicama salad. A lot of fiber there and it taste like an apple. Slice up some shallots or red onion very thin and soak in lime or lemon juice for about ten minutes them toss onions and juice with strips of jicama, can add red pepper slivers and some green herbs too, maybe a bit of olive oil, or not…a sprinkle of paprika…there are lots of variations you can find

      Hope you can find something here that will help.

    • gabriella kadar,

      Aye, a pint is a lot but it is a wonderful carrier for a variety of stuff. I add other stuff: powdered greens, gournd flax seed, protein powder, etc. I put it in a cold thermos and drink it over the course of a couple of hours. I was doing this months before the rice and legumes experiment and was still losing weight. A couple of small nutrient-dense meals during the day, and another kefir “shake” at the end of the day.

      Maybe I should inject my work schedule: I work in the oil fields of west Texas as a “mudlogger,” collecting samples of the drill cuttings while an oil/gas well is drilling then run the cuttings through a few tests, look at them through a microscope, and log the data into a computer. We usually work 24-hour shifts, from noon to noon, in a somewhat cramped converted travel trailer and the key word is “convenience.” Anything one can so to make meals more convenient to prepare and cleanup is the goal. Kefir, loaded with stuff, is about as convenient as you can get. I try to prepare foods at home on my 24-off but sometimes I’m too tired to do it. That’s why having a bulk amount of rice and beans in the freezer was appealing to me; at work they were easy to prepare and easy to cleanup if eaten in a plastic “picnic” bowl. (Now that I think about it, an armful of veggies may work even better. There is no prep or cleanup if one grazes like a cow.)

      I’m really lucky on this well. I’m only 30 minutes away from the house. Usually the other mudlogger and I are far enough away from home to require living on site and the grocery stores in small towns are problematic. Throw in a roundtrip drive of maybe 100+ miles just to get groceries in that small town and “convenience” becomes a mantra. (That’s why many working this job are fat or diabetic; what is more convenient than bread, sandwich meat, chips, and cookies?)

      Just FYI, I get lots of walking. To catch a sample of the cuttings involves a round trip of about 200 yards, usually twice per hour, with a set of tall stairs involved. After being relieved, I usually walk about an hour to get the kinks out of my brain.

    • Ellen,

      Nah, too much trouble. I’m willing to heat a broth to pour over the vegetables but beyond that I’m unwilling to go to much trouble. The problem is my job and schedule where “convenience” is the mantra. See my answer to gabriella kadar when she expresses surprise at the amount of kefir I drink.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      James, I don’t know how this applies to the concoction you are making, but there is this thing about the brain not being able to distinguish liquid calories. So it’s really easy to consume too many calories because ingestion is so easy.

      Don’t know if you sip or gulp, but I would assume sipping would give the brain some change to register calories in.

      Chomping on raw vegetables would probably be a good idea.

      When one of my obese patients decided to lose weight he would eat at least one, if not two large seedless cucumbers before his meals. His rationale was that since his stomach was used to being accommodating large volumes of food, this would provide his stomach with the stretch it was used to but not the calories. I don’t subscribe or support what he was doing. Don’t know where he got the idea or if he self-generated it. He did lose a lot of weight, kept it off for a few years and now is a balloon again.

    • BrazilBrad says:

      When I ate a liter of kefir with 2+tbs potato starch in one day I had some REALLY bad stomach cramps. This happened more than once so it wasn’t a fluke. Haven’t yet figure out what my limit is on that combo. I stopped with the Kerfir for now but will go back to it later. I have no such problems with 1 liter of kefir without the PS, so there’s an interaction going on there that is beyond my limit to handle.

    • James,

      Okay now I understand. Sounds like a very good plan for your circumstances.

      Your schedule may have disrupted your circadian rhythms, making it more difficult to lose the weight.
      You might be able to do some tweaking if you are able to wear orange glasses part of the night, and things like that…..

      Best of luck.

    • james london says:

      I agree Gabriella – I found when I added 10g pysllium and 40g RS to 500g kefir I could happily have it as an alternative to lunch because it’s thicker than porridge. When it’s liquid it’s just a drink. Never understood the Slimfast diet for that reason.

    • gabriella kadar,

      Yepper, I thought of the high-calorie intake from liquid meals, which is why I don’t “do” smoothies. I haven’t figured the calories from the various additives in my kefir shakes but they are intentionally low. None of the additives have any sweeteners or flavorings, etc., just the items in which I am interested. Heck, even the whey protein isolate is unsweetened/unflavored, which is reason enough for the kefir.

      I take about two hours to ingest the stuff. It is somewhat tempting to just down the whole thing if only to get it over with. The flavor, while not horrible, definitely voids any thought of turning to drink into a commercial enterprise. I have gotten used to it but at first I thought of it more as a drink for those with a self-flagellation bend, which I suppose may apply to most fat people with a life-long history of dieting.

    • Ellen,

      Oh, believe me, my circadian rhythms have definitely been disrupted or even broken.

      I thought of trying stuff like the orange glasses but this job is rather dangerous and unfettered vision is a requirement, particularly at night. There are bright lights scattered about the site but they tend to sharpen the division between light and dark; colored lenses enhances that effect. Inside the lab they are just annoying.

      No matter though. After 13 years I am a master, a Yoda, at catnaps, power naps, etc. An uninterrupted sleep of only two hours, if the opportunity presents, will do me for many hours.

      I had to laugh at your use of the word “tweaking.” It is another mantric word with which I live. If “convenience” and “tweak” did not exist, I would have to invent them.

  10. bornagain says:

    Tucks Hemorrhoid Suppositories are 51% topical starch. From what I can tell the topical starch is made from corn which I think is RS2 (not sure though). Anyone tried to get their RS this way?

    http://www.tucksbrand.com/topical-starch-hemorrhoidal-suppositories

    • DuckDodgers says:

      @bornagain,

      Raw potato suppositories are a very ancient form of folk medicine. You can find tons of references to it in homeopathic and folk medicine sources. For instance:

      Herbal First Aid and Health Care: Medicine for a New Millennium By Kyle D. Christensen

      A raw peeled potato suppository can offer great relief [in treating and reducing hemorrhoids]. Cut the potato to the size of a French fry. Insert into rectum and hold for several hours or until next bowel movement.

      I guess solanine doesn’t cause problems on that end :)

  11. I’m now over six weeks into my PS experiment. To start with the weight went on – 1.5 kg in the first 3 days. Then the weight was coming on slowly but surely. I was getting bothered as I was as big as I could be without buying new clothes – 3kg, over 6 lbs. I tried to buy the 3 recommended probiotics but was only able to get Primal Defence from iherb (they dont’ stock one and the third was out of stock). As an Australian we have very restricted probiotics and they are three times the price of getting them from iherb. So I’ve now been taking the Primal Defence since Tuesday (5 days). I had been getting very reluctant to get on the scales with my ongoing weight increase. This morning for the first time my weight went down and my trousers are no longer fully stretched over my abdomen.

    What has surprised me a little has been that I’ve not been on a smooth path. I have a couple of autoimmune diseases which were exacerbated by the RS (AS and RA). I had two bad days when I had to consider pain relief – at the point where I got up to 3 tbs of PS. So I immediately went to 4 then 5 tbs and the pain subsided. On a scale of 0-10 where 10 is the worst ever, I now sit most days on 0-1 for pain with some days a level 2 which is annoying and keeps me on the move as that makes it a bit better.

    About week 4 I had bad diarrhoea and TMI here – the colour went really pale. I felt I had changed my gut bacteria again and was feeling under par and there was no suspicion or reason to think food poisoning. Adding the Primal Defence has darkened things again and while I have the odd day of feeling good I’m still not feeling healthy, though the weight drop this morning is encouraging. I am, however feeling like I used to feel most of the time prePS.

    One thing that was fascinating to me at the beginning was that from day 1 to about day 10 I had a super sensitivity to my emotions and intuition. It was a delightful experience that faded.

    Thanks Richard and Tim. And everyone keep reporting in. Its helpful to read the range of replies.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Harriet, it seems change takes a while to be accommodated.

      I got lower abdominal colic pain when I added too much psyllium. One night in a moment of insanity, I took two tablespoons of psyllium. That stuff swelled up so that I swear I could feel how hard my gut was working on choochooing it along. Now, if I use it at all, it’s 1 teaspoon.

      But this week’s experimentation of making potato starch/soursop/yoghurt/milk/psyllium smoothie ended up with a ‘choke the toidy’ smoothie. :) It was light in colour. I guess there’s just so much dilution with all the starchy, fibery stuff.

    • gabkad,
      I lifted this from Dr. B.G’s comments section.
      A probiotics manufacturer is recommending not to take psyllium with pbx. Never heard this before so curious to see your thoughts on this.

      “http://www.bodybiotics.com/product_detail.php?product_id=5

      Contraindications:

      • The use of psyllium seed husk with Body Biotics™ is discouraged because of its indiscriminate stripping away of both friendly and unfriendly bacteria. Use of psyllium seed husk could minimize the positive health benefits of Body Biotics™. “

    • gabriella kadar says:

      T-Nat, I don’t know anything about this. Don’t take probiotics in capsule form. Don’t regularly use psyllium either. I do think that the recommended dose of psyllium, based on what’s on the bag, is way too much. Perhaps it’s a dosage thing.

  12. Come to think of it my change in TMI to really light came when I added a teaspoon of psyllium husk night and morning with my PS. Could it be that I shouldn’t be having it at the moment?

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Harriet, I think it depends on individual system tolerance for change. When I added the psyllium it was a combo smoothie. Maybe psyllium just bulks things up so much, bile salts are diluted.

      Discomfort can indicate adding psyllium is going too far. I don’t think we need to have bulky stools. Why stretch out the colon? Better the mucilage from okra. I ate plenty enough kimchi, yoghurt, okra, asparagus, onion yesterday (2 corn tortillas, 1 cup rice) but did not take PS. TMI Bristol = 5

    • Harriet:

      (Nice report previously, BTW. Keep it up.)

      Re. Psyllium, my “gut” tells me that just as with any particular food, it’s perhaps something that you should mix up. I’m going to get some, but plan on only using it once or twice per week in a morning smoothie.

    • After reading that psyllium might be a bit much for poor guts I didn’t take any last night and I thought I would give it a miss for a week or so. I didn’t get any discomfort from the psyllium but I did get initial diarrhoea, the colour went very pale and I felt slightly less well. I didn’t make the connection till someone posted above. So I’ll try without it. Having had bad guts all my life mine might be particularly sensitive and allowed the good bacteria to be swept out with the bad.

    • Last week I updated my ultimate gut health protocol (with all the extra help from Richard/Tim/Marie/Gab etc)

      Several have told me wonderful things about g banana flour — John, Charles (FTA fans) — and finally I met one of the owners of Mt Uncle’s G banana flour from AUS. Awesome chap, Rob Watkins. I think g banana flour has the full suite of fiber/RS plus many extra botanicals that aid gut/skin/brain healing. It’s somewhat refined like psyllium but it’s still a ‘whole food’ in my mind. Psyllium doesn’t improve infectious colitis, whereas g banana and g plantain flours do.

      http://drbganimalpharm.blogspot.com/2013/11/how-to-cure-sibo-small-intestinal-bowel.html

    • DuckDodgers says:

      Nice work Grace!

      Looks like you omitted the actual amount of PS (and ORAC) to combine with the 1-3 Tbsp of g banana flour. Is the idea to just have a GBF base and use a fluctuating amount of PS and ORAC?

  13. Hi everybody,

    it has been now a full month, since I started with PS, started eating cold rice and potatoes and increased fermentable fiber in my diet (beans, chia seeds, okra, raw garlic, onions and topinambur). I also started in the same period drinking raw milk and upping my intake of fermented food (kefir and sauerkraut).
    In the beginning, the first two weeks I was feeling very tired. But generally, I noticed that I was losing weight and that I was losing appetite. 10 days ago I caught some sort of flu/cold and I was really sick (fever and whole body aches) only for one day. Diet-wise nothing changed, except that I ate more vitamin C rich fruits, raw garlic and fermented food. It has been a good week now that I am extremely bloated, all the time. No matter what I eat or don’t eat, the bloating does not change. Before the bloatings I was having 4 T of Ps per day plus other sources of fermentable fiber. In the last two days I decided to completely cut the PS. Anybody else has experienced this?
    I must say, that, besides regular bowel movement, although my stool is still far from perfect, I haven’t noticed any major change in energy levels, or other health markers.
    Do you have any suggestions for me?
    Thanks a lot. Drini

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Drini, can’t make out exactly what you’ve been doing. Hard to tell where the problem was introduced.

    • Lots of people introducing RS + Probiotics + many introducing additional fermentable fibres.
      Quite significant changes.

      The case for buttressing the beneficial bacteria is so compelling that I’ve made many dietary changes – in addition to RS – since Christmas. I added psyllium a little time ago and within a few days was suffering with aches and sniffles and on one red letter day produced an hilarious volume of shit. My RS induced equanimity exited the stage too, for a short time, amid a storm of fucks and buggers.

      Researching Herxheimer reactions is a minefield – weirdos and quacks abound, pioneers too – but should we be thinking in those terms when presented with lots of odd and unsettling reverses?

    • Drini:

      When I feel bloated, crappy, start getting heartburn, I do what animals do. I don’t eat until I feel good again.

      Kind of a duh, for me. People always ask, almost in any situation: “what should I eat?”

      It’s exactly like out nature whenever there’s some problem at work, in one’s business, with the spouse, kids, family: “what should I do?”

      Always remember that your options include nothing and nothing, and you would be surprised how often both work the best.

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Art, funny that Herxheimer business. I just did a search for that word on Dr. BG’s blog Animal Pharm. The Maven of SBOs and curing SIBO. Not once has she used that word.

      Now, this is not to say the reaction doesn’t happen, but it occurs in extreme situations. Check it out yourself.

      I had not heard this word used colloquially until a few years ago and then from neurotics who believed that every burp, fart, pimple, hot flash, facial puffiness, you name it was a Herxheimer reaction. So damn scientific I could defenestrate them for wasting my time having to listen to this sheer, utter, bloody claptrap.

      Bollocks. All bollocks. Herxheimer reactions are very serious and life threatening. They are not merely ‘uncomfortable’.

    • ehm ehm…yeah I kinda started doing a lot of things at the same time. I think my body needs an adjustment period. I’m pretty convinced that adding RS and fermentable fiber to the diet is important, so I will keep going and hopefully in the not so distant future I will start seeing the benefits.

    • That’s very good advice. I also noticed that when I get bloated I usually also feel full, so it kinda makes sense to simply stop eating, until it goes away. thanks.

    • …”from neurotics who believed that every burp, fart, pimple, hot flash, facial puffiness, you name it…”

      I have no idea what you’re talking about.

    • My favorite word….defenestrate! But I had forgotten about it amidst all the shorter ones so in vogue now.

      And I couldn’t agree more about Herxheimers it is mostly wishful thinking and just confuses the issue.

    • Have you tried eating grass? My dogs do when their stomachs are upset. No, really. . A doctor told me once that if my kids had upset stomachs to not feed them until their guts healed. I made that standard practice when treating my kids. Then the BRAT diet. I still recommend that.

    • GK – I have to disrespectfully disagree with you on this. I have been trying to treat yeast for a couple of months, and with all the dietary changes and anti-fungals I’ve been on, I have been in a healing crisis for months. I believe Dr. Grace has mentioned “die-off” with regard to starting the probiotics, and on the Primal defense bottle it states to start slowly, as do some other probiotics. You are going to have some toxicity whenever baddies are replaced with goodies, some folks are just more sensitive than others. My yeast die-off, while never “life threatening” was truly scary at times and makes me feel very sick. That, according to my functional med Dr. and naturopath both, is a Herxheimer reaction.

    • Gab~~

      Is poor gut health behind bad teeth overcrowding, periodontal disease and cavities?

      Yes herxheimer is real and just because modern medicine doesn’t know about sibo/sifo or gut permeability doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. I don’t agree with 99% of naturopathic docs but that doesn’t mean herxheimer is a quacky term.

      Some people would say avoiding gluten or eating dirt or shoveling in boatloads of refined white powder is quacky! Lol

      G

    • The gut is mysterious but now the 16S rRNA testing can reveal its contents now. Fungi are found excessively in every ‘sick’ model and paradigm (including nearly ~100% of Genova Diagnostics GI fx stool tests that I run) — modern antibiotics and refined carbs are probably behind most of these. Unfortunately AmGut doesn’t identify this yeast epidemic because it only measures bacteria — no fungi, viruses, parasites, worms or protozoa.

      Have you heard of auto-brewery syndrome? (or SIDS for infants; ‘Fatty liver/NASH’ or CFS for adults not drinking (like me))

      It’s not quackery per Pubmed……..

      Natasha McBride-Campbell in her GAPS book says that most spectrum and austism children are born from moms that are rife with yeast overgrowths and this carries over to the child neonatally. Yeast unfortunately is the great mimicker; it’s protein strands appear just LIKE OUR THYROID……. AND BRAIN……… AND ADRENALS AND JOINTS and all other targets of autimmunity. It sends out ‘growth signals’ like parasites do and demands tissue growth, inflammation and nutrients for its own survival at the cost of the naive host.

      Superorganisms? More like Matrix body snatchers!

      http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-honestly-officer-ive-got-autobrewery-syndrome-1148050.html

      J Appl Bacteriol. 1985 Apr;58(4):355-7.
      Production of ethanol from infant food formulas by common yeasts.
      Bivin WS, Heinen BN.
      Four common yeasts (Candida albicans, Candida tropicalis, Torulopsis glabrata and Saccharomyces cerevisiae) were combined with five infant food formulas and/or supplements (Isomil, Nutramigen, 5% glucose, Coca Cola and Similac) and incubated at 37 degrees C. Gas chromatography was used to measure ethanol production after 24 and 48 h incubation. The quantities of ethanol produced suggest a possible explanation for patients exhibiting the ‘Auto-Brewery Syndrome’ and raises interest in the role auto-produced ethanol could have in explaining the etiology of Sudden Infant Death.

      Can Vet J. 1984 Jun;25(6):251-3.
      A yeast related ethanol intoxication syndrome in experimental calves: prevention with nystatin.
      Wijayasinghe MS, Miranda M, Smith NE, Baldwin RL, Wijayasinghe C, Har SA.
      Abstract
      In a calf nutrition-metabolism study in which a high glucose (60% glucose and 3% lard) versus a high fat (23% glucose and 30% lard) milk replacer were compared, a syndrome characterized by anorexia, an unstable gait, depression, a distended abdomen and an odor of alcohol on the breath was observed in some calves. These signs were associated with intoxicating levels of plasma ethanol and the predominance of the yeast species Torulopsis glabrata in gastrointestinal contents of afflicted calves. Nystatin, a yeast inhibitor, was extremely useful in preventing the problem.

      The auto-brewery syndrome–the repeated attacks of alcoholic intoxication due to the overgrowth of Candida (albicans) in the gastrointestinal tract.
      Kaji H, Asanuma Y, Ide H, Saito N, Hisamura M, Murao M, Yoshida T, Takahashi K.
      Mater Med Pol. 1976;8(4):429-35.

      [Case of malabsorption syndrome, "Meiteisho" (endogenous ethanol intoxication) and polyneuropathy].
      Yamashita Y, Inoue N, Shirabe T, Onishi A, Kuroiwa Y.
      Rinsho Shinkeigaku. 1974 Jan;14(1):17-23.

      Gut Fermentation (or the “Auto-brewery”) Syndrome: A New Clinical Test with Initial Observations and Discussion of Clinical and Biochemical Implications
      Hunnisett A, Howard J, Davies S
      J. Nutr. Med. 1990;1:33-38
      This study demonstrates that alcohol production from oral carbohydrate ingestion is not a rarity but is remarkably common (61%) amongst patients who are chronically unwell. It also presents data to support the use of a new simple clinical test to diagnose gut fermentation that may be due to Candida albicans or other yeasts or bacteria, and thus identify patients who may benefit from a course of anti-yeast or anti-bacterial therapy. (This test does not differentiate between yeast and bacterial fermentation, neither does it exclude large bowel overgrowth of yeasts or “abnormal” bacteria). It is an easy test to perform both technically and clinically, requiring a minimum of laboratory hardware, and it presents to the patient only the discomfort of having two venepunctures (or one for children). It is a test well within the capability of any clinical laboratory and should prove useful in the identification of a cause of a diffuse clinical condition.
      Further studies should be carried out, including microbiological culture of gastric and duodenal aspirates in EtOH producers, clinical response to the appropriate anti-yeast or anti-bacterial intervention, and on the stress on dietary micronutrient supply that EtOH production causes.

      http://www.biolab.co.uk/index.php/cmsid__biolab_abstracts

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Grace, for sure, Herxheimer exists. But the term is used far too frequently and loosely. All sorts of everything are attributed to it.

      Ann, if you have yeast, the you didn’t feel good, right? There are symptoms. The only patients I have who were diagnosed, in hospital, with candida in the GI tract were very ill (that’s why they ended up in the hospital). In all there was serious problem with liver, bile flow, and pancreas.

      Then there are the ones who start talking about ‘Candidia’. Self-diagnosed. That is rubbish. Sorry. If there’s a serious problem, then it needs to be determined.

      Grace, glad you asked. Just this week-end I was looking at a photograph series of babies born super preemie. In the go home photos, it’s clear that these children also have under-developed midfaces. So right there, we have a problem. Normal babies have a smaller mandible compared to the maxilla and nose. This is to facilitate successful breastfeeding. (note: one aspect of Downs’ Syndrome babies is the same structural abnormality and what with difficulties in tongue muscle management, they are most often not breastfed as a consequence. It takes about three months of determination to successfully breastfeed these babies.) Is the midface retrognathism environmentally induced, post birth because super-preemies are not breastfed or is it a developmental problem because these babies are multiple birth, IVF, and they just don’t get adequate vitamin K2 in the first trimester? I’ve seen a number of toddlers who are twin, IVF, super-preemies, and they have the ‘bulldog’ face. There’s other problems with these kids as well. A tendency to develop asthma, for example. A tendency to develop serious chest infections from viral infections that other kids manage without hospitalization. The airway size is compromised.

      The above results in inadequate jaw size with respect to the size of the teeth. Without interceptive orthodontic treatment, they end up with crowded teeth. If extraction orthodontics is done, the problem stays the same throughout life.

      What I see in regards to crowding of teeth usually is a kid who sucked their thumb. Double the problem when the child was not breastfed. Pressure from the hand on the lower teeth/chin prevents the lower jaw from growing forward. It doesn’t matter if the mother breastfeeds or bottlefeeds in this case, digit sucking must not be permitted. You don’t see African babies sucking their thumbs. There are cultures where babies are actively prevented from doing so. Their dental arches are good.

      Robert Corruccini claims that a soft diet is responsible for dental malocclusions. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Corruccini Not sure how well this dovetails with Weston Price.

      I think it’s a combination of pre-natal nutrition, post-natal feeding and habits.

      Of course, if teeth are crowded, they are difficult to clean. So it’s not to be unexpected that decay happens. Overlapping upper front teeth almost universally develop decay on the surfaces that overlap.

    • Gab~

      “babies are multiple birth, IVF, and they just don’t get adequate vitamin K2 in the first trimester?”

      If the mom was infertile, a lot of things ‘were going on’….which affect bones imho besides K2.
      –insulin resistance (that’s why paleo or LC or metformin are fertility boosters)
      –low Progesterone, low thyroid (I have a girlfriend who finally conceived when her repro endo added an extra dose of thyroid on the day of ovulation)
      –low omega-3, low ADE in addition to K2
      –estrogen dom or high T dom or both
      –broken gut, candida, pathogens, bacterial/fungal translocation, blah blah (these can cause all the above)

      Candida — I know a lot of people with it. Like all things, one can have subclinical presentation. When I had 3+ candida on DNA stool studies (because it’s not culturable), I had little symptoms.

      It’s obvious once you know what do look for. There’s no ‘white tongue’ or et cetera like you learned in dental school. It’s a wily pathogen…. The healthiest looking people can be oozing fungi. I think for every chronic condition, cancer and autoimmune disorder, the gut should be the first physical, DNA and organic acid exam until the person is healed and normalized. Otherwise it’s criminal to ignore the gut. It can lead to horrific cancers or pain or other sequelae which are then harder (or impossible) to treat.

      http://drbganimalpharm.blogspot.com/2013/09/my-n1-pre-and-post-microbiome-digestion.html

  14. Hi everybody,

    it has been now a full month, since I started with PS, started eating cold rice and potatoes and increased fermentable fiber in my diet (beans, chia seeds, okra, raw garlic, onions and topinambur). I also started in the same period drinking raw milk and upping my intake of fermented food (kefir and sauerkraut).
    In the beginning, the first two weeks I was feeling very tired. But generally, I noticed that I was losing weight and that I was losing appetite. 10 days ago I caught some sort of flu/cold and I was really sick (fever and whole body aches) only for one day. Diet-wise nothing changed, except that I ate more vitamin C rich fruits, raw garlic and fermented food. It has been a good week now that I am extremely bloated, all the time. No matter what I eat or don’t eat, the bloating does not change. Before the bloatings I was having 4 T of Ps per day plus other sources of fermentable fiber. In the last two days I decided to completely cut the PS. Anybody else has experienced this?
    I must say, that, besides regular bowel movement, although my stool is still far from perfect, I haven’t noticed any major change in energy levels, or other health markers.
    Do you have any suggestions for me?
    Thanks a lot. Drini

  15. I started supplement with ps 4 weeks ago. I went up to 5ts in the morning and 5ts in the evening. My digestion haven’t been been better then this since i started high carb paleo 3 years ago and I’ve been taking digestive enzymes and betaine hcl.

    Sadly my eczema came back and i got like a allergic reaction all over my body, I should have stopped earlier. Other then stop taking ps I’ve now also stopped eating fermented cabbage or carrots every morning. At least it haven’t got worse but it will take time for it to go away.

    I’m thinking about ordering plantain flour from barry farm, using potato starch wasn’t probably the best idea for me with immune problems. Now my digestion is worse then ever, I’m basically afraid to go to the bathroom. I know that if i visit my doctor all he will do is give me antibiotics and cortisone.

    I’m gonna investigate this with cold white rice. Cooked/cooled rice is 5.48g/100g rs. So i would have to eat 550g of cold rice per day to get up to 30g RS. That is a lot of rice. I haven’t seen anyone mention this but when I cook basmati rice i always rinse it before, a lot of the starch rinse off then. Maybe i should be more careful when i clean it.

    I saw that unripe banana could be from 4.7 to 34g each, i guess that is unpeeled. How many grams of green banana would you recommend to get up to 30g rs?

    Sorry if these questions has been already answered. Thanks for all your work.

    • Seb

      IMHO have u considered that u may needs urself some weeding with edible earth or clay to remove some out of control pathogens or parasites in the gut?

      IMHO have u considered that u may needs urself some healthy (organic, no parasites) dirt and SBOs like B coagulans and L plantarum. Have you seen Heisenbug’s blog about L plantarum clearing up his eczema? I’ve used this NOW SBO brand below and it doesn’t need refridgeration
      http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Probiotic-Defense-90-Vcaps/6105

      Have you seen this case of eczema reversal with SBO Threelac (B coagulans, E faecalis, B subtilis)?
      http://www.skincell.org/community/index.php?topic=21731.0

      Have you seen Seth’s blog on a case of 95% eczema reversal with DanActive (which personally I would not touch a GMO probiotic with a ten inch paleostick)?

      http://blog.sethroberts.net/2009/04/29/eczema-nighttime-cough-antibiotics-and-fermented-food/
      Eczema, Nighttime Cough, Antibiotics, and Fermented Food
      When Alex Comb’s son was an infant, he had pretty bad eczema. (Eczema is a reddish dry skin rash.) He also had a nighttime cough, a dry cough that started and stopped throughout the night. The cough lasted months. It turned out he was allergic to carragenen. The cough was mostly, but not entirely, eliminated by avoiding carragenen. Sometimes there were flareups.

      When the son was 2 years old, he had a mild case of eczema. Doctors wanted to give him steroids. Alex started researching the causes of eczema and how to alleviate it. He came across research on the hygiene hypothesis. In a forum, he read that some people had tried probiotics for eczema with some success. Research on the subject had had mixed results but it seemed worth a try.

      So Alex and his wife gave his son DanActive (a probiotic dairy drink) every day for over a year. After a week or so, he noticed improvement. The nighttime cough completely went away. The eczema went away 95%. This isn’t a use of DanActive I could find on their website.

      When his son was 3 yrs old, Alex and his wife stopped the DanActive. They assumed his immune system was better. He had gotten tired of drinking it all the time. He drank it less. His diet got broader too; he started eating yogurt. He never really stopped drinking it, he just drank it less.

      A few months ago, the son started a 10-day course of antibiotics for a nasal discharge. A few days later, the nighttime coughing mysteriously resumed. It lasted at least 5 nights, and ended around the same time the antibiotics did. It was an asthmatic cough rather than a respiratory infection cough. An asthmatic cough is much drier and shorter.

      A few weeks ago, the son was put on antibiotics for an abscessed tooth. Two or three days after antibiotics started, the asthmatic cough started again. Was it the antibiotics? He had not been drinking the DanActive so Alex and his wife started giving it to him again. They gave him the antibiotics earlier in the day and the DanActive before he went to bed. The very first night they did this the cough went away. They kept doing that and the cough stayed away. He has had no cough since then.

      What’s telling is the clarity of the correlations. They support the idea that we have a large need for bacteria-laden foods.

    • “I would not touch [...] with a ten inch paleostick”

      Grace, if you have access to 10″ paleostics, you haven’t shared it with me even joking around. I’ve heard that paleosticks are about 6-7″ or thereabouts.

    • Thanks for your reply. I tried a cleanse protocol maybe a year ago, I didn’t feel much difference from it. However not with earth or clay.

      I take a probiotic with l-rhamnosus Rosell-11, l-plantarum rosell-1012, b-longum rosell-175 and b-breve rosell-70. However I’ve thought of trying some soil based probiotic.

      After stopping with with potato starch the allergic response is getting better, however I would guess it will take me a month or more for it to completely go away again. As it’s not a linear progression.

  16. Richard,

    I’ve been getting a lot of comments lately of “wow have you lost weight?” I have only lost 2-3 pounds. Maybe my face has thinned out.

    Last summer I was about 163 (5’9″ 31 male). Around November – December I was about 173. I experimented with a high calorie diet with lots of wheat and sugar (aka, eating regular pizza/ice cream) while keeping a good 3:6 ratio to see how it would impact my digestion/skin/strength/body composition. Strength went up rapidly, everything else stayed pretty good. Around November – December I started adding potato starch.

    Starting last month I dropped the ice cream, and most of the wheat, adopted more of a leangains protein oriented carb cycling approach. Definitely not low calorie, and keeping it pretty flexible. Pretty un-paleo at times (unless you consider eating 6 bowls corn flakes with 1-2 pints 1% milk post workout paleo).

    I started getting the compliments a few weeks ago so I stepped on the scale. 169. Next week 171. This week 169. I’ve gotten comments from about 5 people in about 2 weeks. Previously, the only time anyone asked me if I’ve lost weight was when I went from about 190 – 160 about 5 years ago, and that was a pretty drastic change.

    Granted, I’ve changed a lot in my diet over the past couple of months, and even incorporated (in addition to potato starch) kefir, Uni-Liver, K2. Lots of confounding variables. I’ve mixed up supplements, probiotics, diet, calories, macros in the past, though, and the only thing that I’d never tried is RS supplementation. Given the stories popping up about facial appearance and RS, and that I’m getting these compliments often while wearing a suit, I’m thinking potato starch is making me look thinner in the face.

    Stress has been very high this year, as well – Work is crazy, rough break up, dog died, sick twice (I rarely get sick), sleep has been poor.

  17. Four months along with daily PS, originally 6 TBL’s/day, then 4 for the last six weeks(?) My outstanding FBG of a few months ago has crept back up to 100, plus or minus, from 80-90. Still a lot better than the 127 typical pre-RS. But when I last did a cup of black beans, 40 grams of carbs, the one hour point was 160-165, I don’t recall exactly. Without looking stuff up, call it 4-6 weeks ago. And then it took three hours to come down. Not great. Good FBG, not so good glucose test.

    I decided to try the potato hack, but was concerned about my insulin production/sensitivity. I ate some potato early in the AM, and at the one hour point, 139. Hmmm…..

    Then about 11AM, 18 ounces of boiled reds with skin. Over 80 grams of carbs! After eating, I jumped on my mountain bike and headed for the beach. I was supercharged! I attributed this to more glycogen stores from the starch and that I had a lot of BG circulating. I set a new personal best by two minutes in 4.5 miles to that destination……..with a headwind!

    At the one hour point I was expecting the worst. What’s this? 149. Not 170 or something. OK, OK, maybe the riding sucked the BG down a bit. Ninety minutes later, 122. Sweet! I rode home, then at two hours, 97! From terrible response to “normal.” (Sometimes it’s good to be normal!)

    For me, on this route, an 11.5 mph average has always been “good” for me. Today it was 12.1.

    There are only two things that could account for all this: One would be the magnesium supplement I started maybe two months ago, magnesium being critical for glucose sensitivity per my readings. The other is that RS took this long to make the difference.

    It’s 5PM, I’ve eaten less than 1000 calories. Mostly potato but some bone broth and raw cauliflower and diced tomatoes and green chiles. Two grams of fat, total. I’m not hungry. Damn, I want a good reason to eat something.

    OP, carded at 45, I’m jealous. My last carding was at 35. Sigh.

  18. Does anyone know where in the world people actually routinely eat raw green bananas or plantains? I realize many cultures use them cooked, but I can’t seem to find any references to where they are routinely just sliced open and eaten. I get that they are an inexpensive and easy way to incorporate rs starch into one’s diet to increase beneficial gut bacteria, but wonder about the long-term effects if countries who regularly consume green bananas and plantains always cook them. I’m not questioning the beneficial effects people have experienced, I just find it strange that countries who grow and use bananas and plantains regularly always seem to cook them when they are green.

    • Adrienne – I doubt there are or were any cultures that ate green bananas regularly. However, there were/are lots of cultures that rely on green bananas as a major starch source. Eating sweet, yellow bananas seems to be a very modern invention and those type bananas have been specially bred for high sugar content and large size.

      It seems the most common ways that bananas are consumed in 3rd world countries is peeling green bananas with a high starch content and steaming them, then pounding into a mash and cooling. Also, drying green bananas and grinding into flour used in cooking a similar mash.

      Green banana flour seems to have excellent properties of forming RS upon cooling, so in that regards, if cooked and cooled bananas were a majority of your calories, you’d be getting a good dose of RS and other fibers.

      What you see as strange (cooking green bananas), is the best way to salvage the starch in them. For hungry people, starch is much more preferred than sugar–maybe not in taste, but in storage and calories. Look at the pictures in this article, you can tell all these bananas were peeled with a knife.

      http://www.ugpulse.com/heritage/matooke-buganda-s-mmere/539/ug.aspx

      Dealing with green bananas is probably much easier than ripe as well on a large scale.

      The thing with us eating nasty, raw green bananas is just about maximizing RS while eating minimal food. Same as potato starch. Certainly no culture ate lots of raw potato starch, but many ate lots of cooked/cooled potatoes.

      Then again, if you jump in a ‘Wayback Machine’ set on 2,000,000BC, you’d see lots of folks eating raw foods. Maybe even green bananas.

    • I just throw one in the blender with some water, frozen blueberries, a couple of tablespoons of free-form BCAAs and some L-Glutamine, some PS, and some steiva. You get the good banana taste, but not the weirdness of eating green bananas whole, which I don’t care for.

    • In the wild, eating green bananas is also a competitive advantage. There’s not a lot of competition for unripened fruit. I grow bananas in my yard and once they start to ripen – and they don’t all ripen at the same time on the stalk – the first customers are fruit flies and once they infest a single banana fruit all the fruit in contact with it start to spoil, then comes the tree rats and possum – it becomes a race to see who gets the ripe fruit first – thankfully there aren’t any monkeys, other than my grandchildren, in the neighborhood.

      Once the ripening gets going, you can have 10 or more ripe bananas a day…I can’t give them away fast enough and Durianrider isn’t one of my neighbors.

      Eating a fresh tree ripened banana that you just picked is a real experience…

  19. Two questions about green bananas:

    How green to they have to be? Is partly green good enough, or does there need to be NO trace of yellow?

    Did I imagine it, or did Time say somewhere (maybe on another site) that banana flour will produce RS when cooked and cooled? Unlike, tapioca or potato starch?

    • The RS is consumed in the ripening process, so very green is the most RS, very yellow, little to none. You’re always on a curve, it’s always going to be different. A good bet is to get as green as you can, peel and cut them up, freeze in smoothie size portions.

  20. Tim not Time….fat fingers and iPad.

  21. It looks like sprouted lentils are an option for me. I ordered them online from the To Your Health Sprouted Flour Co. That said, I made this lamb lentil curry recipe with sweet potato and carrot over the weekend and it turned out great.

    http://www.food.com/recipe/lamb-and-lentil-curry-138542

    • James’s comment reminds me of a question that has often occurred to me. I know sprouting helps use up and remove some of the phytates in grains nuts and legumes, but would it also change the amount of starch and resistant starch?

  22. Richard, Tim, Gabriella – So I’ve been doing the RS as plantain that I make myself, 4-6 tablespoons per day. At first I was getting really low BS readings, second meal effects, etc. Felt great about the program, and started to add in small quantities of sweet potato, rice, rice noodles, etc, at about 1/2 cup per meal, sometimes three times a day, sometimes only two as some days I only eat two meals a day. Started the three probiotics that Dr. G recommended. Have been eating home cured raw sauerkraut, which gave me horrible headaches until I started the probiotics. Things were going along fine for a while, and I felt like I was really having the great response so many others have talked about.

    I am also dealing with leaky gut, adrenal fatigue, insulin resistance, and many food sensitivities. My worst struggle began last September when my insulin was so high that I was constantly in a state of hypoglycemia with the resultant anxiety and illness. I went VLC in an attempt to lower my insulin levels, which has worked very well, and at my last testing in December I had already lowered my insulin to 1/4 what it was in September. I was very pleased and feeling better. The stomach issues, however, got worse, and I was in bed most of December and January with constant diarrhea and food intolerances. My food, any food, shotgunned right through me and I quickly lost 32 pounds. I also suffered through severe yeast die-off and all that resulting crap. I had the GI Effects test done which found nothing out of the ordinary with the exception of very low SigA, and high PH. All of my commensal bacteria were low, but in range, with Fusobacter being high. Otherwise all well.

    I have been doing the RS and probiotics and things are getting better. I’m slowly adding foods back in and eating the most “normal” diet I have eaten in close to two years. Thought things were really turning around. The most remarkable part of it all was how much better I’ve been feeling.

    This week, however, I’ve hit a bump, and I’m not sure how to respond. I will admit that I’ve had a week where I’ve had a little too much food “fun”. Had a few gluten-free cookies this week, more yogurt and kefir than usual, coconut water every day, and tried to add in tapioca starch as another form of RS. I’m back on track with the food, and after seeing my BG numbers spike a little with the tapioca, I’ve cut that back out. The problem is, I can’t seem to get my numbers back down, even after cutting those things and going back to doing what I was doing before the high numbers.

    I want to make it clear that I am not diabetic, but have been diagnosed with Insulin Resistance. This week I’m also feeling a little of that old anxiety creeping back. I’m really hoping that my insulin hasn’t crept back up, even though my BG numbers were staying low. A lot of people never even realize they have pre-diabetes because if their insulin is high in a clinical test, their blood sugar numbers often stay very low. I was only diagnosed with insulin resistance after discovering cysts on my ovaries. My BG numbers were always very low, even when my insulin was sky high.

    I’m not saying one week of coconut water, a few gluten-free cookies, and making a mistake with the tapioca starch would be enough to do that, but I’ve also added in the rice and sweet potatoes, and that could do it.

    How long, after a food mistake that causes high readings, should my BG stay high? The past two days, I’ve been getting three hour readings of 140 after eating a meal of ground beef, tomatoes, zucchini, and 1/2 cup white rice! That seems ridiculously high for that meal, and I have not been experiencing that during this time. Things have been going so well with the RS post parandial readings that I’m really shocked and a little stressed about these high numbers.

    Unfortunately, I was not testing my blood prior to doing the RS, so I don’t have any history to go on before that. My last Dr. test before getting my own meter was a ten-hour fasting of 97.

    This has also been a very busy and stressful week for me. Does that commonly affect both diabetics and non-diabetics in terms of blood sugar readings?

    I’m not sure how worried I should be about this, but I am worried. Any thoughts?

    • I also forgot to add that my numbers have been a bit higher after sleeping, whether it be a nap, a night’s sleep, or just accidentally falling asleep during a movie. This seems very weird to me. Even before I slipped up on the crap eating this week, I was starting to notice that my fasting morning numbers were higher even after I’d had my RS drink and probiotics before bed.

      Has anyone heard of the RS just not working after a while?

    • gabriella kadar says:

      Ann, are you unwell this week? Since you weren’t doing glucose testing in the past like you are now, you don’t really know what was happening then. You can’t compare. Having urges to eat sweet junkfood might be a clue. We all want to eat easier to digest stuff when we don’t feel well. It’s your BRAT diet. (Which normal person is doing glucose curves after a GI upset that requires low residual, easy to digest food for a few days?)

      The reason I’m asking if you maybe picked up a virus or something is because I know from my own readings, that if I’m unwell, glucose goes bonkers and then it goes down too low. Otherwise it’s always in a narrow range.

      Right now I’m clearly not 100%. My guts got torn up by the home made kimchi and then more irritants. They are not calmed down yet.

      Inflammation will cause blood glucose curves to become exaggerated. A big dose of African yam just blew my glucose to a level I’ve never seen before. (plus cooked carrot and chayote). Blood glucose goes high to assist immunity when a person has some sort of inflammatory thing going on. When I was sick in early January, even a medium small baked potato made the glucose sky rocket. A week later, the same thing did nothing of the sort.

      At the time, it seemed to me that the signalling to the beta cells was delayed. Insulin didn’t surge for about 45 minutes. Then it over secreted and blood sugar would go too low. Morning glucose was on the high side.

      Once I recovered from whatever happened (probably sleeping in the freezing cold, no electricity due to ice storm. Then having heating restored so it was very dry in here because I forgot to open the window a crack whatever virus was hanging out but unable to cause trouble, did, due to drying out of mucous membranes) cleared up, the glucose levels became nice and normal again.

      Just a few thoughts….

    • Ann,

      Yes — stress does affect BGs (blood glucoses) directly. Also stress and cortisol (and negative thoughts) instantly change our gut microbiota to the adverse side — reduction in beneficial commensals, skyrocketed increases in pathogenic strains.

      Consider Step #7 of the ultimate gut health protocol — adding adrenal strength to fortify the gut.
      http://drbganimalpharm.blogspot.jp/2013/12/how-to-cure-sibo-small-intestinal-bowel.html

      Can you walk, swim and/or do yoga? I recommend yin yoga for everyone who lives in a stressed state (and few don’t LOL!) Most yoga studios now offer yin yoga but there are some cool vids on youtube as well.

      Have you figured out the root causes of the insulin resistance?
      –low anabolic hormones? progesterone, testosterone?
      –low adrenal hormones?
      –high adrenal hormones? cortisol, adrenaline? excessive crossfit?
      –heavy metals? arsenic, mercury?
      –pesticides, pthalates and other toxins?
      –too many high carb gluten-free GMO corn products?
      –not enough exercise and/or strength training (weight training)?
      –not enough commensal microbies which are vital in regulating insulin resistance and fat storage?

      The gut is integrated with all the above so we can’t ignore the other inputs and their cross-bound effects on each other.

      have you thought about volunteering at a friend’s garden or CSA farm to get healthy soil exposures and microbes? Plus it’s fun and you can meet like minded folks who enjoy the outdoors!

    • Ann, without even reading your whole post or any of what my partners in criminal conspiracy have written…what the fuck, girl?

      You will never get beyond this obsessing with every number. It’s crazy and no animal ought be caged like that.

      Take a month off. Don’t step on a scale. Don’t measure a thing. Eat and drink what you feel like, with conscience, so long as you have at least some pizza.

      Report back.

    • Gabriella, yes, today it seems I’m either coming down with a cold or suffering allergies. Here in Wa state, we get outside whenever it isn’t raining, and we have seasonal stuff. Walking and hiking the past couple of days in the sun seems to have caused some immune response-sore throat, pluggy ears , headaches, and sniffles. I should have known. I do need to stop testing so much…

      I get a little worried when I’m trying so many new things, and have such a wonky response.

      Thanks so much for the prompt reply.

    • Thank you Richard! You have no idea how much I follow your advice. I am going to put it all away, starting tomorrow, and see what happens. How far off the rails can I go in a month? This is just the permission I needed. I will use conscience, and make good choices, but will not worry about doing it perfectly. Jesus but this can drive a girl crazy…

  23. tatertot says:

    Ann – I wouldn’t worry too much about the numbers you are seeing. Get an A1C test soon and another 3 months down the road. Continue to eat good food and avoid vegetable oils, sugar, HFCS, fake colors and flavors, and wheat. I don’t even like gluten free stuff.

    Start a good exercise program that includes some strength training, make sure your sleep is really good and you have no sleep apnea issues, and walk a lot.

  24. Dr. BG- I am on adrenal support. I was tested in October, and my cortisol was low, normal, high, and high-normal over 24 hours. I take Thorne Adrenal Cortex, and every vitamin that supports adrenal function. I’m sure my IR was caused by the low-fat high complex carb push in the ’90′s combined with hours of exercise seven days a week. I have eight amalgam fillings, but getting them removed is a pipe dream for now until there’s a death in the family…

    I limit my family’s exposures to toxins, buy organic and grass-fed hormone and antibiotic free, and cook at home. We do lots of walking, and I shoot for twice a week with free weights. I have done yoga, but find it hard to get my head in the game. I have a profoundly disabled sixteen year old son, so a certain amount of stress is a given, but I’ve worked very diligently on managing my stress this past year using hypnosis, guided imagery, meditation, EFT, and relaxation techniques.

    I believe with all my heart that my obsessive compulsive tendencies about my health are a direct effect of having so little control over other areas of my life, and I am working on this. Blogs like this one and Animal Pharm are my panacea in my quest to heal my body..

    I am following the seven steps diligently. We have a garden, it’s just the weather that doesn’t cooperate. We are really only able to dig about four months out of the year, and after that it’s mud pies. Tough to live in such a wet climate, and depressing, too.

    Thank you so much!

  25. Ann,

    My wise goddess just suggested to me recently that our ‘greatest wound is our greatest gift.’ Don’t discount your OCD talents and skills which apparently you lead you here! Why do we worry or despair or cerebralize and instead of just laughing and letting certain things go…?

    You know what works for me? Rehmannia — its a nice botanical that helps ‘let go’ until we can mentally do so. Either below support adrenals beyond and more than what glandulars and vitamins do. Have you heard of adaptogens? In Asia, ginseng is the most common adaptogen but there are many other ones with superb properties. As you are a brilliant goddess, you must be aware anything that improves cortisol decreases insulin demand and requirements.
    http://www.iherb.com/Planetary-Herbals-Rehmannia-Endurance-637-mg-150-Tablets/1582
    http://www.iherb.com/Planetary-Herbals-Rehmannia-Vitalizer-750-mg-150-Tablets/23214

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