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Refining the Resistant Starch Story – Part 3 (RS3 Content in Food)

Part 1 of this 3-Part series dealt with incorporating a diversity of fermentable fiber in the diet as more ideal than isolated RS alone. Part 2 dealt with the difference between raw RS2 resistant starch and RS3 retrograded resistant starch. In this final post in the series, we cover what sources of foods you can use to up your RS3 intake.

Much of our frustration in reviewing hundreds of studies conducted over 30 years on Resistant Starch was the observation that there was not much dietary recommendation—beyond silly stuff like eat more cold potato salad! But, early on in our experimentation, we discovered how easy it is to work your food food into a form more in line with the ways our ancestors ate their food, e.g., cool-reheat-recycling. This creates RS3 (retrograded resistant starch) from staple starches.

Many studies of diets around the world show that most westerners are getting 3-5g/day of RS, another 3-5g/day of inulin (mostly from wheat), and less than 15g/day of total fiber. This is a far cry from the 80g eaten by poor, rural, modern day Africans subsisting on stale maize porridge, or the 135g+ fiber eaten daily by Paleo-Indians of North America. 15g/day of total dietary fiber probably ensures a person can form a stool and break occasional wind, but this is also the gut of the Pepto-Bismol generation. At any rate, you'll find that shooting for 20-40g of RS3 from real foods also gets you a good bit of other fibers. Here’s a list of international RS3 rich foods that are low glycemic index carbs, to feed both your muscles and microbes.

Most people will be getting their RS3 from potatoes, rice, and beans. Of the three, beans have the most total fiber in various forms. But many folks eschew beans, due to their demonization by The Paleo Diet™...and perhaps also, their propensity to reward flatulence in unaccustomed gut biomes. We assert that this is a monumental blunder that persists unchanged, largely unchallenged, unedited, un-reconsidered—now, a Catechism. A Doctrine. But beans or legumes have a long history of feeding some of the healthiest, longest-lived populations on earth. Unfortunately, "science" is often unmoved by real world observation. Oh, well. You get to decide anyway.

...Moreover, we're far more concerned with what's actually healthy and beneficial long-term—for both the 10% of you, and 90% of them—than in adhering to catechisms and doctrines about how much protein and fat ancestors ate to the exclusion of the other foods they could have, in many cases, more easily gathered and eaten. It doesn't make sense on even more levels than health claims.

Certainly, many of you know the pain of counting calories. Many of you have also counted carbs, fats, or protein (excepting proteins like snake venom and others of the most poisonous substances on earth). It's fine to do so, to count and account, to gain insight into what you're eating—much like tracking your money to see why you're a dollar short at the end of the month. As a long-term strategy, though, it never works as planned for non-OCD people.  For most, it's better to just learn to recognize the foods that are rich in RS and other fibers, and include them in your diet regularly. The last thing we want to do is create another program that requires meticulous tracking and counting.

...Here's another tidbit we've discovered along the way, while researching RS: Approximately 10% all all ingested starch, resistant or not, escapes digestion in the small intestine and serves as fuel for gut microbes. Some foods even contain natural amylase inhibitors. Might this be an evolutionary adaptation to feeding our critical gut bugs? So, just eating starchy foods will feed your microbiome a reasonably healthy dose of fermentable fibers.  So, alas, rather than spend valuable time counting RS in the foods you eat, just include beans, rice, and potatoes in your healthy eating patterns to various degrees, including from hot off the stove to frozen, thawed and reheated—or eat them cold, sometimes. (To maximize RS, you pre-cook and cool them. This not only increases the amount of retrograded resistant starch, but makes these time-consuming staples almost a fast-food. Can it get any easier than that?)

Some other tricks to increase your RS intake: use parboiled rice, like Uncle Ben's Original. In theory, it contains higher RS as it's been pre-cooked and cooled. If you don’t care for Uncle Ben's, choose long-grain pigmented rice, i.e., brown, red, or black types, for more RS (and antioxidants) than your typical long-grain white rice.

Potatoes are a bit higher in RS content, compared to rice, but also contain 10g of fiber (not counting RS) per pound; and again, the purple varieties of potatoes have more RS and antioxidants than standard varieties. Beans of all sorts contain about 10g of RS per cup, but also 20g of other fiber. Also, consider the myriad other sources of RS3-producing foods like plantains, quinoa, lentils, and yams. Corn can be a wonderful source of RS—but many are (rightfully so) opposed to corn due to GMO concerns. Eat lots of foods that contain edible seeds: blueberries, strawberries, bananas, etc..

Did anyone catch the important insights left by DuckDodgers in a comment last week:

I've uncovered evidence that traditional cultures all over the world have been creating lots of RS3 for a very long time.

Biology and Chemistry of Jerusalem Artichoke: Helianthus tuberosus L., by Stanley J. Kays, Stephen F. Nottingham

"Precooking the tubers has been a culinary practice for many years and is mentioned, for instance, in the 1633 edition of Gerard's Herball and in the 1738 edition of La Varenne's le Cuisinier Francois."

Indian tribes actually made RS cakes!

Tuber & Root Crops

"Elephant foot yam chutney with or without dry fish is [a] common dish among the tribes of Tipura and Meghalaya...Cooking the elephant foot yam in bamboo shoot ash water and after decanting water, the cooked tubers are made in to paste and dried in the form of a cake. After drying, the cake is again cooked in bamboo shoot ash water and dried in sun after decanting ash water. This dried cake can be stored for 30-45 days without any quality deterioration."

And my personal favorite...

North American Cornucopia: Top 100 Indigenous Food Plants, by Ernest Small

"Duck potato was in fact a staple food for many Indian tribes. On boiling or roasting, the tubers became pleasant in taste. Some Native North Americans sliced boiled tubers and strung them on twine to dry and store for winter use (dried tubers store about as well as potatoes)...The dried tubers can be ground into a flour."

And then we have the "Blue Zones" where people tend to live exceptionally long lives for a number of reasons. But, it turns out, most of those "Blue Zone" cultures have one thing in common that nobody really notices. They were all relatively poor [Grace: and have soil exposures via gardening and farming!]. And what do poor people do?...

Why do sardinians live so long?

"Sardinians were poor for most of their history. And so their diet is incredibly simple and frugal. Their traditional dishes are about using up leftover pasta, bread, meat and cheese."

Yep. They were saving all their foods and inventing ways to reheat them because they didn't have the resources to waste their food.

The Nicoya (another "Blue Zone") in Costa Rica had their Gallo Pinto, a leftover rice and beans dish. In Panama and in El Salvador, they call it Casamiento. In Cuba it's known as Platillo Moros y Cristianos.

Tuscans have their Ribollita. "Bubble and Squeak" is a famous leftover potato/meat dish in Europe, and just about every European culture had their own version of it.

Wherever we look, we see a long tradition of saving foods and dreaming up new ways to reuse them.

There were also societies that utilized isolated, raw starches (RS2) in a variety of interesting ways, but never as a main source of calories and nourishment.

  • Horchata de Chufa, a tigernut starch drink that is still enjoyed by many around the world today;
  • Fufu, a starchy dough made from cassava root eaten in Africa;
  • Chicha, similar to Horchata de Chufa but made with corn;
  • Chuno, a dehydrated potato staple of the Andes;
  • Tororo, made of the Asian yam Dioscorea opposita, often eaten with Natto;
  • Nuts and Seeds. Probably every single culture enjoys munching on raw nuts and seeds. Sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds, chia, flax, and all manner of tree and ground nuts are universally enjoyed by people around the world and contribute to a healthy gut.

CONCLUSION:

Looking back at our original set of parameters, we still have a ways to go, but here's the progress we've made:

Unanswered Questions

  • What is the optimal dose? Approximately 20g conventional fiber and 20-40g per day RS (RS3 or mix of RS1, RS2, RS3);
  • What is the optimal source? Real foods that provide a combination of RS and other fermentable fibers;
  • Will it make a difference in the grand scheme of things if implemented on a world-wide basis? Undoubtedly, and we're quite fucking sure about that!
  • Is it contra-indicated for anybody?  Rather ironically, those who need it most are the ones who will have the most trouble tolerating and getting up to speed with these recommendations. Various levels of gut dysbiosis leave people unable to ferment prebiotic food, or it is fermented by pathogens. On the bright side, there are a number of people in that state, figuring it out and passing on their knowledge.

Absolutes

  • RS supports a healthy gut microbe population.  ...But only if the healthy gut microbes are present;
  • RS exhibits undeniable effect on glucose control and satiety. Glucose, yes; satiety, mixed results;
  • RS in amounts of 20-50g /day are well tolerated. ...Unless the gut is already compromised by pathogens or disease;
  • RS can come from many sources including real food. Absolutely! It's the point, now that we've seen so many thousands of positive anecdotes even on less optimal isolated RS, like potato starch.

So far in 2014—less than 6 months in—there have been 51 papers released on PubMed with resistant starch in the title or abstract. Interest in RS is not waning but increasing—and we're gratified to be a collaboration of leaders in the RS popularsphere. What a marvelous opportunity that has rewarded countless improvement in real lives...and in so many cases, correcting problems from faulty popular errors that involve starving the gut; i.e., very low carb and ketogenic diets in chronic, rather than episodic practice.

The most recent paper, released just this week, is an RS3 animal study with human implications:

Effects of resistant starch on behaviour, satiety-related hormones and metabolites in growing pigs

The study concludes:

Possible underlying mechanisms for RS-induced satiety include increased 24h plasma SCFA levels, and decreased postprandial glucose and insulin responses. GLP-1 and PYY seemed not to play a role in RS-induced satiety. Low blood serotonin levels in RS-fed pigs suggested a difference in intestinal serotonin release between treatments. Increased postprandial plasma triglyceride levels corresponded with increased SCFA levels, but it is unclear whether triglycerides may have signalled satiety in RS-fed pigs.

So you see, it's not just us with unanswered questions, it's everyone. When you consider the interactions of RS and 100 trillion gut microbes in up-to 1,000 species in snowflake diversity per individual—and its effect on the brain-gut connection—it becomes massive. Eventually this will all get sorted out. Or not, and we'll just toss our hands in the air, seed and feed.

Until then, we’ll keep an eye out for even more daily revelation...whilst others focus on only 10% of you, trying hard to motivate you—day after day—to starve and maltreat 90% of the cells within the borders of your skin. Good luck with that.

We assert that they—from VLC to trademarked Paleo (unchanged since 2002)—will lose. We're looking forward to it, because it can only mean healthier guts in the context of quality foods, and healthier people—free from the unintended consequences of VLC and meat-fat-non-starchy-vegetable "Paleo" diets.

Comments

  1. eddie says:

    Richard ,
    ***** tator and Grace*****

    I spent the weekend reading all of the starch articles etc over and over , reviewing everything. As well everything I know about yeast/fungus over and over. I reviewed tators AMgut results , mine as well. I looked at several studies etc. My heath is fine now, but No RS??? -sinus , GUT, sleep and so on digestion markers etc good– never breathed so well. But in investigating my results and Tators I noticed the key factors like this… His RS he eats gives him more Actinobacteria , ME I have ZERO from the american gut. I have Verrucomicrobia which in my mind and testing eats inulin due to the large amounts I eat.( my structured diet) I eat alot of fiber –from plants only( low starch sources) Now – since I have ZERO Actinobacteria , I have pretty much no protection from yeasts/molds on the long haul– But I eat alot of herbs and foods etc that kill them in general. why I maybe so successful. A key antifungal is the drug nystatin which is a soil based bacteria that attacks yeast and is Actinobacteria.

    I have spend 2 years killing lowering yeast and mold and raising what I consider the gut barrier bacteria Verrucomicrobia (Akkermansia) which I can say for certian has brought me back, raising this while lower yeast. NO MORE GLUTEN issues and I carry 4 genes in the HLA DQ2 area. In the process I have eaten no RS and have been successful at building back the gut lining and killing it.

    Now I think it is time for me to try the RS and a soil based probiotic –to try and add in Streptomyces and others that will in the end regulate and keep me in check for the distance. I m going out and saying my jejumum -I bet was loaded in the start of my experiment with yeast which also moved down to IIeum and colon ..Due to no Actinobacteria. thanks to the antibiotics of past use
    You hear me run my mouth alot HAHA , about the yeasts /molds in the end Im going to point to penicillin antibiotics , killing off my good bacteria( a factor maybe in many around the world) , allowing yeast to grow, and this antibiotic add in its a type of yeast /mold that confusd my immune system more .As the proteins in molds/yeasts look like gluten soy and cassien. Eating these foods daily crashed my immune system making it work hard and not do the job it was intended for. Giving me the nasal, allergies which finally ended with the gut failing –with all the added bonus problems nails headaches , gut failure , fistula acid reflux , ulcers you name it.
    By using all these expensive tests, I have been able to pin point things in blood , fecal, immune responses bacteria / yeasts etc . to enable my switch to health. My long period of foods removed that were noted starches, gluten milk and soy gave my immune system time to rest restart and heal with the help of killing lowering yeast. …

    Now my goal is to keep this good health , but by doing this , I will need Actinobacteria etc to keep all this from coming back. Why I think so many fail in there candida treatments. The few that fail here with RS I think are so overload from yeast and there immune system has crashed so bad , and we are talking to small few RS doesnt work. maybe what I have done will help.

    So , I think I want to introduce soil based probiotics and take a chance. I may activate my disease — time will tell. I think It would be a good test for your experiment and my experiment. But first I will need to run the ELISA act bio , and enterolab to get a basis on where my immune system is and where my fecal responses are to , milk, RS and soy. In two weeks I will do my IBD expanded panel and 3 weeks the others to get a baseline.

    Please let me know which SOIL based probiotic you recommend and the differences
    I think this would be a very interesting experiment for all. I will do the American gut as well

    In the end If I can get the Actinobacteria SOIL based stuff to stick the RS will be the life long firewall to block my yeast issue, I believe seen pasted done many generations causing type 2 and gut issues . I point to all this as many end up with sinus , gut etc problems around the world. You look at a gluten intolerant person and many celiac they dive for there foods –which are rice flour , corn and potato flour…they never heal and still have stomach issues and sinus. there just not eating gluten.. Its not the RS in my eyes its the lining and yeast….they can take advantage of the RS due to the other issue keeping them from growing the good bacteria

    • Eddie

      This may be my favorite comments of yours. Understand there’s no way in a 24-hr day to reply to most of them.

      The gist, to me, is that you’ve figured this out on your own, and it was a laborious, 24/7 job that requires constant monitoring and now you are seeing the possibility that your could “hire some employees at slave wages,” and have them keep tabs.

      Here’s the probiotics:

      http://freetheanimal.com/2014/02/probiotics-component-obesity.html

      After taking 2 per day of each for a couple of weeks, I went to one per day of each for another week or two, and currently do one of one per day (so one cap of one brand every three days). Since they are expensive, this is how I think people on tight budgets can still get their dirt…cheap.

    • eddie says:

      Richard

      thx I know I run my Big mouth a lot!!!! and have alot to say. Just so many are so lost at where I was and how I am today( doc wise) I understand theirs no way to respond . I hope in the end it all helps people and science wakes there @ss up–and stops being so focused on killing your gut and immune system rather then optimizing it. Tests like the GDX and great plans and others steer people in the correct direction for correct drugs / supplements– rather then tossing a dart at a board with your eyes closed – like your general office doc

      When Im ready I ll let you know when I start the RS, and document what happens to me internally bacteria / yeast wise. Stool, skin , nasal and or headaches.. which I will get some im sure.—as many side effects are also immune reactions to die off.

      Thx for the probiotic link

    • tatertot says:

      eddie, eddie, eddie…

      I’ve tried hard to ignore you, but your enthusiasm is contagious. You will definitely have a great tale to tell one day, keep meticulous notes and records and keep plugging away!

      The thing about RS, it’s not imperative. Many ancient cultures lived just fine without it, but those cultures ate tons of fibrous plants full of inulin-like fructans, or, in an extreme example, from animal fibers like DuckDodgers laid out so well for us a while back. But all of the cultures had another similarity–they also ate a wide array of other prebiotics in smaller, but synergistic quantities. Tree bark, twigs, plant bulbs, corms, pollen, etc…. And they also got a large load of probiotic microbes from dirt, animals, and each other. Nearly every culture in the last 16,000 years or so also concocted fermented foods.

      I’d give you some advice, but it would be no better than what you are already doing. Keep us posted!

    • Gemma says:

      “But all of the cultures had another similarity–they also ate a wide array of other prebiotics in smaller, but synergistic quantities. Tree bark, twigs, plant bulbs, corms, pollen, etc…. And they also got a large load of probiotic microbes from dirt, animals, and each other.”

      Eveyobody should read this at least 150 times. Full stop.

    • Gemma ,

      That jumps out at me too….from my tests and tators !!!! PREBIOTICS and the of course probiotics GUT lining prebiotics and probiotics soil based for health fiber to feed them

    • Tator ,

      A neat add on to your test(amgut, ubio and GDX would also be , if you could —two standard blood tests at your docs office

      CRP c -reactive protein
      &
      if theres a lab corp# test 162045
      IBD EXPANDED PANEL– antibodies -AMCA ASCA ALCA ACCA PANCA

      Both are blood tests— I will suppose you will have a super low CRP score and would be cool to see your results on IBD EXPANDED PANEL– with all the action bacteria ,I will guess LOW AMCA and ASCA would be good and proof for your experiment..

      others that have issues and problems will have high AMCA and ASCA

      If you could do those man that would be cool , if you have good insurance , most likely both will be covered

    • tatertot says:

      I was planning on getting some labs drawn the same day. I doubt they will do hsCRP or anything ‘expanded’ but I can usually talk them into a pretty full range of tests. I really want to see my A1C, ALT, K, WBC, HDL, LDL, Trigs and a few others I’ve been tracking for years.

      I don’t have good insurance!

    • Tator ,

      I had GOOD insurance until OBUMA f-ed it up For me almost all my stuff was covered 100percent now I have to pay out of pocket for the first 2600 family(deductible then only 80 percent is covered)I have to reach the deductible before anything is paid for
      On that note 75 percent of the tests I do , no doc has heard of anyway(advanced I pay out the nose–but need them to sign the order) but the normal ones are somewhat covered

      I have united health care insurance , my new plan Works like this yours maybe the same
      Even thou I have to pay first out of pocket you get the discounted rate the insurance has with the lab

      Example IBD EXPANDED PANEL #162045 labcorp is 318.00 but the discounted rate is 34.40 the rate the lab charges the insurance being in the plan… the problem I havent met my deductible so …I pay 34.40

      Man if you could get the
      CRP creative protein — a cheap test cheaper then A1C etc
      &
      IBD EXPANDED PANEL 126045 labcorp
      this IBD panel would in my eyes explain alot into your bacteria , blocking AMCA and ASCA if low

      CRP is an inflammation test.. if your sick or have an infection or inflammation somewhere this usually goes up. From my diet change I dropped to almost NOTHING. There are more accurate GI inflammation markers as well in -what all lowered for me changing bacteria and lowering yeast

      It would be a hell of a test if you could get them in too!!!!!!!Any reason your doing A1C to show effects on starch with blood?? all diabetes people and many IBS people have high antibodies to ASCA or AMCA…why I say this would be cool to see in you…and run my mouth alot– throughout what im doing the antibodies lowered to normal levels and docs are lost

    • I also suspect the ones with diabetes using the RS some how with the soil based probiotics w/ RS may over come the yeast by UP-ING the action bacteria , blocking the affects of yeast -aka lowering and killing some. The Action strains seem to be very good yeast killers many others regulators

      Boy would it be good to prove this!!!!

    • I have wrote a couple things and keep adding see my other comments please as well

      now I do this cholesterol test— NMR lipoprofile http://cholesterol.answers.com/calculating-cholesterol-levels/uncommon-but-important-cholesterol-tests ****far better then the standard bullshit one —-half the people on drugs may not need to be on them
      This looks at the trys LDL and HDL but also looks at the particles of HDL and LDL as well the size. if your healthy your LDL particle size should be large fluffy type…. if small… well not so good ….( time to also get APO type)

      For me as time has gone on..Im in a uncharted area– I have an LDL of 111 and HDL of about 65 trys hang around 70

      But , I have large LDL size (good) and low LDL-P particles only 105 last time( this drops each time) but my overall LDL particles keep climbing , at 1399 now. Standard medicine says you should be under 1000 total particles(based on a shity diet avg diet). All my EKG’s are good blood pressure 106 / 68 avg . My calcium cardiac score a 1 — as well many others things good. Some say cholesterol is antimicrobial, and Im starting to believe this as I have more floating around but not sticking and clogging( small particles —>would be like panning for gold–small fall through and clog build up—the larger dont fall and stay inside moving…. — time will tell , Im willing to roll the dice. I may have a heart attack who knows??? but my Gut seems happy same with my blood work , immune testing and inflammation testing

      I dont buy into the cholesterol thing, I feel its the yeast and bacteria leaking in killing people from eating to much bad oils, sugars ,processed foods- NSAIDS –low fiber low inulin to much alcohol and antibiotics making for a leaking gut –getting to blood stream. The natural role of cholesterol is to go to the site of inflammation distress and repair–Im sure these nasty bacteria and yeasts are like ticks when let loose.

      I have no inflammation in any CRP or any GI marker test now…. extremely LOW.

      There are two top experts saying to different things
      1) says its the lower the LDL-P number and bigger LDL size which I have low LDL-P and large good size
      2) the other saying its LDL-P and the total number of LDL particles

    • newbie says:

      Hi eddie,
      You sound like a guy who enjoys delving deeply into a topic. If lipids turn your crank, you should geek out at http://www.lecturepad.org/
      More information about NMR lipid panels,
      hsCRP, apolipoprotein B100, B48, and all of the A and (a) lineage, newer stuff on CEPT – it never ends. Maybe you’ll end up with more expertise that your docs! Like the GI thing.
      Have fun with the site.

    • newbie says:

      IMHO, size is irrelevant, it’s LDL-P (or apoB) – IOW absolute numbers of particles floating around your plasma, that predicts cardiac risk.

    • Newbie ,

      Theres a fight in this world to , is it small LDL-P or is it LDL-P total particles then you have is it both. THEY dont know just like the GI doesnt know about your gut

      I am somewhat of a freak… I EAT HIGH FAT good fats , BUT EAT tons of veggies fibers and inulin.. I would say cholesterol is antimicrobial
      I think the particles are the hunters. Cholesterols job in general is to go to the site of distress and repair zap out, clog bind etc….if there is no problem- there floating around .hence I think the problem lies in bacteria or fungus getting into the blood stream. For me I have about 100 small LDL-P particles but 1399 total LDL particles — if you break that out about 8 percent of my LDL is small LDL-P clogging particles .If SMALL LDL-p is what there point at –which is said the real bad stuff MY HDL is good in the high 60′s size etc on both are good. My heath is very good now
      you see cholesterol medicine doesnt work as everyone is still dropping dead

      Now you have these freaks like jimmy moore over at Low carb… eatting all fats and sticks of butter… hes had up to 350 cholesterol levels and particles up to over 3000– yet no heart disease etc— hes ran every test possible — he has killed off many of his gut bugs ..thats a fact , I cant get him to send me his results. We know all fat low carn distresses the gut bugs

      For me , when I was sick and all those antibiotics my total cholesterol dropped to 158
      since eating fats its rose slowly and stopped here LDL 110 and HDL 65 my trys move pretty much and im only seeing my particles LDL-P go up ( not the LDL standard number…. small LDL-P is going down HDL going up as my yeast has lowered I have been raising GOOD bacteria jump up and I am slowing adding them feeding them… at a slow pace…and again soon RS with more soil based…. I currently take RENEW life 50 billion 10 strain…. moving to the 14 strain renew life soon has a couple more strains of bifido

      Im seeing strange things…. cardo is better etc if I havent ran in a long time …I can just get up and go.. I count the fats and cholesterol killing off the bad bugs… the inulin closing off the gut… and fibers to feed my bacteria .. As I have seen all my gluten and milk/ dary problems leave. Same with beer. If I want to rarely enjoy these I can now.. I point to yeast high bacteria low , giving me a over -screwed up immune system to yeast– with many proteins looking like yeast(aka milk, soy and gluten) I have lost all docs.
      Now , I want to replace more missing bacteria with the RS feeding some bacteria I feel will block me from getting yeast in the future

    • Wilbur says:

      Eddie -

      It’s amazing how different we are but see similar stuff. I agree with 98% of what you say, and I’ll stipulate that I am wrong on the other 2%!

      I’ve been doing a lot of moderate walking. That’s my cardio. Yesterday I decided instead water sprint as hard as I could for about 30 seconds and then just paddle for about 2 minutes. In 4 foot water. I was amazed at how easy it was on my cardio system. I was breathing hard, but that’s about it. I could not have pushed harder in those 30 seconds. I kept this up for about 1.5 hours with a couple short breaks.

      “I just get up and go.” That sums up a lot of stuff I am seeing in me too.

    • newbie,

      ill check it out thanks…

    • Wibur,,,

      changing my bacteria lowering yeast…etc I see a big difference— If i rarely exercise…The cardio seems still fine…the muscles no I feel it there ..But I feel I can go and go and go like you say– cardio

    • Thanks for posting on the NMR lipoprofile test. I had one done, but my doctor is not familiar with it. I seem to be seeing conflicting data-

      Flagged as High- LDP-P=1650, Small LDL=900
      HDL-P=34, LDL Size=21 (trending towards large Pattern A)

      So in the Interpretative section, HDL-P and LDL size are trending towards lower risk, while Small LDL-P is off the other side. Can anyone with more knowledge of these tests give some feedback? Thanks.

    • All cholesterol tests are based on the avg shittybdiet people eat but

      The size of the ldl p paricle is important
      Same with the hdl particle

      You do not want to be over 500 for ldl small ldl p
      They say the ldl particles total should not be over 1000 bu there is a fight here

      You want to have a higher Hdl good fats will raise this number olive oil avacodo coconut oil real grass feed butter you small ldl p is not so good
      You want to up your hdl which helps you exercise and good fats . Most of all experts say total ldl particles should be under 1000… a limted group point to just the small ldl p… google jimmy moore nmr lipo profile his are at time 2000 and over at timesmy ldl p smal is 100 my ldl total particles are 15000 below 10 percent.. yours is 1650 particles you ldlsmall is 900 roughly 55 percent of your total ldl particles have ldlp small moving arounnd.. your goal is to get ldl small p down and up your hdl …but per more then half the experts you also want total particles down my self …I dont care …

      I also have hdl size of 37 and hdl score of 64

      How high where your trys

    • Sorry for type os the mobile site sucks…why I have so many

    • Thx Eddie. If you have ever heard an interview with Dr. Lundell, he says don’t even look at cholesterol. I actually had the NMR test done with the same blood draw as a standard lipids profile, just to see the difference:
      NMR , HDL-56, Trg-75, LDL-150
      Standard, HDL-64, Trg-61, LDL-148
      So the HDL and Trg #s are significantly different.
      I did up the healthy fats in my diet (coconut oil, butter, eggs, etc.), and what I saw (6 months between NMR tests), HDL-C and HDL-P went up but the small LDL tripled. Trgs stayed about the same. LDL size decreased slightly.

    • The good fats will raise the hdl
      The sugars and heavy carbs seem to move up trys.. to much they get stored..

      Im sure you have read the ldl is like a load on a truck
      For me I eat alot of fat and eggs but I also eats shit loads of nuts tons of veggies and inulin

      For me my hdl keeps going up ldl is stuck and stopped at about 115 my try move depending what I eat…. hdl hangs 60 to 70

      Due to my strane diet of half fats and half veggies lots of fiber and inulin

      I have retested every 3 to 4 months for 2.5 years to track the effects .. what I have seen in me hdl go up ldl rise but stop at 115 . Each 3 months my total ldl p goes up but the small ldl p goes down

      Carbs and fats dont seem to mix well to me from what I see…

  2. Jandj says:

    Sorry to go a little off topic here, but I have a question about soil-based organisms. I ferment organic veggies–mostly cabbages (kraut) and beets (kvass), and occasionally other veggies. I use salt and water, but I do NOT add whey for fermentation–organic veggies come with their own microbiome. Isn’t this soil-based fermentation? I know the process is still referred to as “lactofermentation”, but there’s no dairy involved. These veggies came from the soil, and presumably the soil based organisms that hitchhike along with them are the ones responsible for the fermentation that occurs. I understand that some lactobacillus may be part of the bacteria that come along, but it seems to me that whatever is in the soil would predominate. The gist of this question is that I wonder if I’m correct in assuming that if I consume fermented veggies I am already getting SBO’s???

    • Jandi

      I’ll let Tim answer because the term SBO is a bit peevish for him.

    • newbie says:

      I’ve had the exact same thoughts, I do hope Tatertot weighs in.

    • Gemma says:

      Lactobacillus plantarum is almost everywhere, also on the cabbage leaves, hopes to feast on it later on.
      It may not be necessary to use a starter, if you have your organic veggies, full of microbial life.

    • tatertot says:

      Rest assured that if you put a vegetable (or dairy) on your counter and it starts to ferment on its own, it is due to a free-living microbe that is probably at home in the soil.

      L. plantarum, specifically, seems to be one of the more beneficial bacteria around us…it’s responsible for making beans ‘bubble’ when left in a bowl of water overnight and also for turning sauerkraut into cabbage. I doubt there’s a household in the world that doesn’t contain some L. plantarum, but I could be wrong…

      So why do we need to buy L. plantarum in a pill? I think it is more a matter of potency (colony forming units). The beneficial attributes of most probiotics seem to occur with 1 million or more CFUs, in a real life setting, we may only be getting a few hundred or less CFUs.

      Lactofermentation refers to the lactic acid produced by the bacteria that ferment the cabbage and beets.

    • newbie says:

      Thanks Tatertot, that last sentence has cleared up the misunderstanding – I thought the “lacto” prefix of lactofermentation referred to lactose in the substrate (instead of the correct meaning which is lactic acid producing), and therefore fermentation which occurs with dairy products only – I think you cleared this up for Jandj too.

    • newbie says:

      Here’s a good link that explains it, for those who are still unsure …
      http://www.culturesforhealth.com/what-lacto-fermentation/
      Lactobacillus bacteria have the ability to convert sugars into lactic acid through a naturally occurring fermentation process. The Lactobacillus strain is so named because it can readily use lactose, the sugar in milk, and convert it quickly and easily to lactic acid. So lacto-fermentation does not necessarily need to involve dairy products.

      So, in all of the probiotic supps/foods, it seems we are referring to SBOs – whether lactos or strep, etc.
      My question – are there non-SBOs that are important in this discussion? Apparently, even the bifido infantis is considered an SBO, and it comes from mothers’ breastmilk.

    • newbie says:

      I TAKE THAT BACK – it is bifidobacterium bifidum that is an SBO – so sorry, don’t want to confuse anyone as I am sorting through the nomenclature to try to get an understanding of this stuff!

    • Newbie ,

      I know this bifidobacterium has helped me greatly!!!!!

  3. Is it just me or can you tell the people that have the most “turmoil” in their guts based on the length and intensity of their posts? While the people with the seemingly worked out innards have calms,sparse 2-3 sentence replies? Haha Now for the weird shit..

    Anybody else get noticeable increase tinnitus after dosing RS? I swear I can tell when Ive got a big enough dose, when my ears start ringing. How about noticeable (to the point of apology) increase in seminal volume?

    Richard/Tim, assume you have to take work trips consistently and can take a bag of Bobs or a Bag of Green Plantain Flour http://www.ebay.com/itm/231250203386?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

    Which would you take for a better meal for your bugz? I seem to be able to “feel” the PS as it causes me to feel warmer for some reason.

    • Cory,
      I’ve been doing internet research to find a cause for my husband’s tinnitus. Several websites mention that it can be caused by dehydration. I’ve also heard that you need to drink extra water when you eat potato starch because it absorbs and holds water water as it makes it’s way through the gut. I wonder if this might be what’s happening with you?

    • Gemma says:

      Anne, Cory,

      re: ear ringing, tinnitus

      I have directed the same question to eddie in a previous post.
      He thinks it is Candida related. Ask him for more info.
      RS does not feed not only beneficial microbes.
      It might be you are feeding “caged vipers”.

      Back off with RS and start weeding (read Animal Pharm) and feeding your mucosa bugs with inulin. Add seed with probiotics, SBO might be the key.

    • Cory,

      Dehydrated can be a problem, there are many causes … If one wakes up with a dry mouth and BAD breath you have to re think things– MOUTH breather at night??? Bad sinus as well , snores loud?? Why I point to the sinus as well as the gut. You may be fixing the gut / or also feeding the wrong gut monsters at the same time. Depending whats in you—why GRACE and I point to expensive tests—to figure that out. If your sinus is over ran with fungus/yeast , your going to have allergies and sinus problems here as well. (which can point to the ringing) From what I have done in 2 years I have noticed you need to fix the sinus and gut at the same time.. Try olive leaf extract spray for the nose rotating grapefruit seed extract spray.. both are antifungals and kill bacteria. If you have sinus /allergy problems this may help greatly- like anything dont use it forever… as well try some drops of grapefruitseed / teatree oil —both kill yeast/fungus verywellhttps://www.google.com/shopping/product/2356429719140442192?biw=1366&bih=657&sclient=psy-ab&q=nutribiotic+ear+drops&oq=nutribiotic+&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.68445247,d.cWc,pv.xjs.s.en_US.hKiVy-E3KVo.O&tch=1&ech=1&psi=LtuWU_ryKfjMsQTlgoLgCw.1402395413529.7&sa=X&ei=i9uWU__VA87isAS7nYGYAw&ved=0CLYBELkk For me I feel you re infect your self if you have problems in the sinus/ ear.

      As well how much work has been done in dental?? root cancel ??? on the side of ear ?? or dental implant??? crown ??? does this person have cracking noises in there jaw on that side when opening the mouth??? Many things can cause ringing–many factors For example. I had a dental implant which drills almost into your sinus. after my treatment clearing out my sinus of yeast , I dont have nasal drip etc..now But notice at times the fluctuation of ringing… more often better now, If im dehydrated I have noticed sound , yet drinking alot of water brings on the sound, why I point to dental– you can freely search all this.. Just my experience

    • I’ve had the exact opposite effect with the ear ringing. For the first time I can remember I have periods with no ringing whatsoever, or periods where the ringing isn’t nearly as loud as I’m used to.

      The other change I’ve experienced is the lack of hay fever symptoms I am having this year.

    • Is there a difference between fructans and inulin? I have problems with fructans. (skin and joint symptoms)

  4. “How about noticeable (to the point of apology) increase in seminal volume?”

    I’ll take credit for that. You’re welcome and I too, will accept your apologies.

    • Great, so Im not the only one putting Peter North to shame as of late.

      This isn’t really a recipe but its easy.
      -Cooked then refrigerated(36-48 hours) potatoes.
      cubed.
      -3-4 pieces of bacon, allow to cook until 3/4 done
      then add a few collard green on top.
      -Once the collards are slightly crispy from the
      bacon grease add in the cubed potatoes and turn the stove off, allowing them to soak up to bacon grease and warm up.

    • Who is “Peter North?”

      You can’t possibly mean the fucktard of fucktards in the VLC world, unwilling to shut up long enough for what VLC Gods had spoken, and being impatient, had to put out…because he’s Primal, and he’s North!

      …I’m sure the Antarcticans just hate Albers.

    • Ha!! No, I was referring to Peter North the “film star” aka King of Pop. Forget I mentioned it.

    • Give yourself a break, Corry.

      Other day I did a John Holmes ref. Sad, as unlike being penetrated for money, he got it up for money in over 2,200 porn films, and given the size of the equipment, TG pump must have been running strong.

    • gabkad says:

      What’s a TG pump?

  5. The comments section of this post might be a good place to accumulate recipes. So I am going to repost Marie’s black eyed pea dish. I have made this with a number of different beans, cow peas being the closest I have come to back eyed peas. it has beed delicious with all of them. I am addicted!!

    Tiens :
    __black-eyed peas, soaked 2-4 hours (this bean variety doesn’t need much), then boiled, rinsed and strained. I do 2-4 lbs at a time.
    __balsamic vinegar and/or apple-cider vinegar (yes, they actually go well together if you wish)
    __extra virgin olive oil (Greek only, of course!. ‘Kalamata sweet’ if you can)
    __raw mushrooms
    __raw or slightly sauteed onions (‘wilted’), just enough to “tuer lucifer” ie. extinguish the “match-strike” teary-eyed smell – we’d say to “take the edge off” (this also reduces stomach gas for those susceptible)
    __marinated garlic
    __tomatini
    __ham (homemade, just sitting in celery juice and salt)
    __sea salt, oregano and/or black pepper to taste

    Can have warm or cold. Works as a fantastic side-dish to that ‘sweet and tangy’ sauteed liver you’ve seen before too (use the same vinegar to ‘blend’ flavors).
    Travels well.

    We make peas and ‘wilted’ onions on the weekend and keep in the fridge, then add the other stuff at each sitting for a few days, doing this maybe every other week or at least once a month. A diet “Staple”

    So especially when cold and eaten through such weeks, it occurred to me that it gives some decent RS as well, together with the obvious inulin.

    This makes most of the happy-making gut bugs have a party, yes?

    • You had me at “tiens”

      For those who don’t know, it’s a French way of expressing “here, take this!”

    • gabkad says:

      Ellen, I’ve also found that black eye peas are the best. The skin is thin.

      I cooked some big red kidney beans and forget it. The skin is tough and even a half cup gives me bloat. My TCM says that it’s the skin of the bean that causes trouble. Chinese baking uses the insides only.

      Lentils are good too. I’m using the decorticated orange Turkish lentils for soup. Boil the lentils until they are soft. Then in good quality olive oil sautee onion, garlic, mustard seeds, cumin, and then chopped red sheppard peppers or yellow bell peppers, sautee them too and add those little tomatoes. I keep the heat relatively low until everything is well sautéed. Then mix into the cooked lentils. Can be eaten at room temperature next dayssss… Add chopped parsley or cilantro as garnish. When serving add yoghurt if you want it richer or real sour cream.

      1 week it’s the black eye peas, next week it’s lentils. 2/3 cup of either and the gut bugs appear to be happy.

      The yellow chickpeas are good too. Grind them up for hummus. Sesame (tahini) is good stuff. Make a big batch and use as dip with raw vegetables.

    • marie says:

      Ellen! I am grinning devilishly to see you are addicted ;)

      I am also delighted you posted my family’s recipe, I couldn’t remember where I had posted it.
      My grandma called this dish ‘essentials’ and when I look at the compination of proteins, starch, fats, RS, other fiber, inulin, minerals, phytochemicals and that vinegar, I’m thinking she wasn’t exaggerating.

      I wonder how they compare for you since you’ve tried that recipe with other beans, but black-eyed peas I think may be some of the best for people rediscovering beans, because they are naturally low on sound effects (!) and then after a week or two when you get more used to them, you don’t really need to presoak them even that 2 hrs.

    • marie says:

      Richard,
      Voyons, tiens-toi bien! Je ne suis jamais si catégorique (nope, never, not me, uh uh ;) )

      For those who don’t know, I use ‘tiens’ in it’s much gentler form : “Here you go”.

    • Marie,

      the salad dressing: which way of preparation is in your secret Greek family recipe for the “elixir of life” salad?

      Shake (don’t stir)?

      Sprinkle and no mixing?

      More French or Italian way?

      I am sort of curious…

    • LaFrite says:

      Tiens tiens! Richard donne des cours de ‘french’ ?

      ;)

      PS: for those who don’t know, doubling up ‘tiens’ means something like ‘well well’ … ah! rien n’est simple en ce bas monde :)

    • Gemma, you know about curiosity and cats? At least, there are no bears here ;)

      The shaking though, that is a British thing. We just pour vinegar over it, then pour oil. Then toss the salad.
      So, option number 3, post-sprinkle mixing?

    • LaFrite, ahahaha! Yes, nothing is simple in this world, or, earthly existence? or, mortal plane?…. including translating that expression :D

    • No bears allowed into the kitchen :-)

      So Greek is more like the Italians do it.
      The devil might be in the detail. Or matter not much if not on a death bed.

      I actually prefer the French way, myself:
      (mixing oil + vinegar + salt + mustard + adding the finely cubed onions etc.) It kinds of pre-chews the fiber for them, the little ones?

      http://www.davidlebovitz.com/2009/11/how-to-make-french-vinaigrette/

    • gabkad, the question above to Ellen goes for you doubly, have you found anything as mild as black-eyed peas for gas and general ease of digestion? The small decorticated lentils, yellow, orange and brown, are pretty good too maybe…?

    • One thing i wonder Marie, is where do you get your marinated garlic? Or do you make your own?

      I have been making my own for years, filling a pint jar with the cloves, separated but still with their skin, covering with raw apple cider vinegar and 2 tablespoons salt. Let sit a couple of years…the longer the better. I aim for 5.

      One of the reasons I jumped on the recipe was that it was a good use for something that I happened to have on hand on quantity. But aside from this Persian version I had never heard of marinated garlic.

    • Marie,

      Re gas: it is hard to say because I came to this recipe after almost a year of RS induction—- so I don’t get gas from eating any of the beans that I have tried recently.

      Mostly I made this recipe with chana dal because I had a quantity of it. I suspect that would be an easy one for newbie digestion.

      I did use cow peas for my first time and they were excellent. But any of the other peas under the grouping Southern peas seem to be very similar to black eyed peas . There are many : field peas, cow peas, crowder peas , and many others with names such as Knuckle Purple Hull, Big Red Ripper, Whippoorwill, Pole Cat and Mississippi Silver.

      But outside of the south what most people know of and can purchase are the black eyed peas, which originated in North Africa and is maybe why they are grown so much around the Mediterranean.

      All of the southern peas can be eaten at three stages: as a green bean, as a shelled, fresh bean and as a dried bean.

    • Okay, my Southern husband who grew up eating what they called field peas, crowder peas or calico peas says he has no memories of farting or farting jokes about those , whereas they always referred to beans as the musical fruit.

    • LeonRover says:

      Mmm, Marie

      Curiosity .. .. Cats .. .. Bears ..

      Post mixing sprinkles ? A Shower !

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkyBx_LkDCw -

      :)) :))

      Léon

    • gabkad says:

      Marie, I go the other way: oil first, let cool, then vinegar. This way the skin of the bean or vegetable is protected from the acidity. Adding acid onto vegetable skin seems to harden it up.

    • gabkad says:

      Marie, exactly true.

      Hard skinned beans: my grandmother ‘pasziorolt’… i.e rubbed them in a strainer to get the inner parts to go through and leave the skin behind. Made a puree. I think she knew something a lot of people have forgotten.

      Chickpeas are fine. Black eye peas, decorticated lentils are fine.

      I’m tired of buying a bag of beans (whatever it is), soaking them and then boiling them only to discover that the skin is tough. Then I throw out the rest of the bag.

      Restricting my purchases to dePuy lentils (now grown in Canada, cheaper but not as exquisitely French and expensive), other lentils, black eye peas, chickpeas.

      Take 2/3 cup per day as ‘medicine’. Tasty medicine.

    • gabkad says:

      typo: paszirozolt.

    • gabkad says:

      jeebus: passzirozott.

      Phew.

    • Of course, that is the difference. There are beans in the elixir of life. Clever Greeks.

      No mixing oil with vinegar.
      Reminds me of hummus. No, there is lemon juice. Still confused.

    • Léon, chéri? That’s a hell of a runaway word train. Next stop, soul asylum :D
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wg60Az10A_E

    • Eddie,

      would you happen to know why is garlic effective both against Candida and cancer?

    • “why is garlic effective both against Candida and cancer?”

      And viruses too. Damn.
      Another underground Hobbit.

      Antioxidant Health Effects of Aged Garlic Extract
      http://herbs.ph/attachments/article/1113/Antioxidant%20Health%20Effects%20of%20Aged%20Garlic%20Extract.pdf

    • @marie

      “The shaking though, that is a British thing.”

      007 Salad Dressing?

    • i use garlic , onions almost every day!!!! :)

    • Gemma,
      ahaha! I can see the ad campaign now…
      007 Salad Dressing, licensed to kill boredom at the dinner table ;)

    • @marie

      Any news from the heights of Mount Olympus?

      Any verdict from Athena, the goddess of wisdom, courage and inspiration?

      Could it be so simple to behead the Gorgon Medusa? Of the three Gorgons, only Medusa is mortal…

      Could she be safely approached, her head cut off, by viewing her reflection in the polished shield?

      Is winged stallion an animal?

      Free The Pegasus.

    • Oh supplicant, only the rage of the titans can free Pegasus.

      Parry the Gorgons’ green-eyed stare before it freezes you and yes, watch for all that is shiny.

      Free Prometheus.

      Above all, do not pair Olympian wines with gaming, it’s an ungodly combination :D

      Athena

    • Not for the ears of mortals.

      This is The Druid Goddess of The Oak Tree speaking to The Athena The Goddess.

      Can Prometheus steal the divine fire?

      Was Gorgons’ blood sour?

      Andromeda is waiting.

      Free Pegasus.

    • Ah! And yet, attentive mortals will think these goddesses insane. Divine?

      Pythia’s guidance for today : wisdom and beauty are not served well at 3:30am. Alas, Andromeda is destined to wait past another dawn ;)

    • Oh, the night is young?

      Summer solistice is coming.

      Is the wine in Athena wineyards sweet or dry?

    • Or was it Dandelion Wine?

      Together, not Alone.

      http://youtu.be/Ih1WLx9ZrY0

  6. newbie says:

    Richard, the link you gave for the list of RS3 foods, is to a post of Tatertot’s on AnimalPharm, listing veggies , some of which are RS2 sources if uncooked, some are high fiber/NSP foods. Is there a list of foods that are naturally RS3 (crystalline amylose structure), without the cook/cool/reheat cycle?

    • gabkad says:

      newbie, RS3 is only present in cooked and cooled. No raw sources. You don’t have to reheat some sources. Pulses for example can be eaten at room temperature.

    • tatertot says:

      Just trying to get you thinking in terms of ‘food’.

      I have been having a blast this summer getting non-potato starch prebiotics. I did a stint of mega-prebiotics from a bottle, just to see what was available and how it made me feel, now doing the exact opposite–getting it all from food.

      The food route requires getting well out of my comfort zone. I’d never even heard of Chana Dal, but Bob’s Red Mill sells it and it’s darn good!

      Today, for instance, I had a green banana (some yellow) for breakfast, a large ‘salad bar’ salad w/cold kidney beans, mushrooms, green peppers, onions, and raw spinach (and a skinless chicken breast). Dinner was 1 whole avocado, some reheated cold potatoes, a big ‘splat’ of homemade mung bean hummus, and some leftover fish. Dessert was 4TBS of greek yogurt w/blueberries, cocoa powder, and 2TBS of ground flax seeds. Oh, and a handful of cocoa beans for a snack.

      I have absolutely no idea what the carb, fiber, RS, or calorie count was today, nor do I care. It was a high fiber day and I feel great.

      Compare a day like this with a donut for breakfast, Mickey-D’s for lunch, and Hamburger Helper for dinner, with a side of Pringles and dessert of ice cream.

    • LaFrite says:

      “Compare a day like this with a donut for breakfast, Mickey-D’s for lunch, and Hamburger Helper for dinner, with a side of Pringles and dessert of ice cream.”

      Is that how some ppl eat ?? No wonder they stuff themselves, this is quasi-starvation of basic ‘cuisine’. Damn! They should teach kids how to cook from whole fresh raw ingredients …

      Your high fiber day is a typical day at home. The alternative will never cross my mind.

    • LaFrite
      yeah man eat like that cola, Mc D’s and all that food you said –tons of sugar antibiotics — no wonder so many are sick ..
      your feeding all the bad things

    • @tatertot

      Concerned about your ground flax seeds. You ground them fresh, I hope. It goes rancid very fast, ditto flax seed oil.

    • tatertot says:

      Yep, grind from seeds and keep in fridge for maybe a week.

      Flaxseeds are one of those things where you read good things, then bad. I dunno. I’ll eat them for a couple weeks, then stop for a while.

      What is your opinion on flaxseed?

    • LaFrite says:

      Re flaxseeds: I can’t care less :)

    • It goes rancid RAPIDLY (both crushed seeds and oil). Eat it fast.
      So much can happen in a week… don’t you think?

      And as they are very potent (grounded), it is probably OK to listen to your body.

    • I notice if I use flax to long I get nose bleeds…
      To much / build up will give you diarrhea as well

      I still use it, But 1000 mg once or twice a week

    • Elizabeth says:

      Hi Tatertot-
      Fyi, flax seeds don’t have a long history as a food source- it was domesticated in the fertile crescent for industrous purposes such as cloth, linen, and later flax seed oil was used for paint. But flax as a food source didnt exist until recent history. Chia seeds, on the other hand, has a long history as a food source in southern California and Mexico- you can even forage chia seeds here in California! My personal opinion is to avoid flax since our ancestors did’t consume it.
      P.s. Im enjoying this blog and Grace’s and enjoy your comments and guest posts. I’m learning so much!

    • Tatertot – are there other sources of mucilage other than Psyllium Husk?

    • I know plant sources to be

      the following plants are known to contain mucilage

      Aloe vera
      Basella alba (Malabar spinach)
      Cactus
      Chondrus crispus (Irish moss)
      Dioscorea opposita (nagaimo, Chinese yam)
      Drosera (sundews)
      Drosophyllum lusitanicum
      Fenugreek
      Flax seeds
      Kelp
      Liquorice root
      Marshmallow
      Mallow
      Mullein
      Okra
      Parthenium
      Pinguicula (butterwort)
      Psyllium seed husks
      Salvia hispanica (chia) seed
      Ulmus rubra bark (slippery elm)
      “plantago major” greater plantain

    • Purslane…that weed that is taking over my garden right now is said to be mucilaginous. Make a good salad

  7. tatertot, I love this 3-part series of posts refining and updating the resistant starch story.

    To me, the massive research you and others have compiled has shown above all else how important is gut microbiome diversity and how reliant it is on diet.

    So then, it’s important to maintain a gut-friendly diet with as much variety as possible, that is, with complex whole food sources of both probiotics and prebiotics. That’s the key to a healthy gut microbiome and so to overall health?
    (and o.k., Hippocrates was a genius…of course! :) )

    It’s so easy to lose that broader picture though when looking at all the fascinating studies one by one.
    So I’m not surprised, but I’m really disturbed, to see anyone trying to micromanage their gut biome with only isolated sources of prebiotics or individual strains of bacteria.

    There’s a thousand (or two) bacterial strains and only some of them have been studied up to now, while there are also synergies between whole phyla, more and more being discovered regularly.

    Taking only some isolated strains and/or some isolated PS or fiber supplements while neglecting the diversity found in real foods and through natural environmental exposure is much like the western habit of taking a multivitamin while eating mostly crap-in-a-box. Yes?

    • tatertot says:

      Thanks, Marie. And thanks for letting us bounce some of these ideas off of you. I’ve always been impressed by your ‘gut feelings’ on things!

      Have you ever seen those books that want you to “Eat this–not that”? That’s kind of what we need when it comes to food choices for gut bugs. Page 1 would show real foods (eat this) and a pile of supplements (not that).

      I guess I am somewhat out-of-touch with reality in the way I eat, but when I travel and have to eat out every day, it really shocks me at what passes for food. Everything soaked in mystery oils and taste enhancements of unknown origin.

      I think there is value to trying to manipulate a gut with targeted probiotics, but the goal needs to be a reliance on yourself and not the probiotics. Yeasts and other pathogens seem to really want to dig in deep, creating an environment for them and putting them firmly in control…this requires “Eddie-like” diligence to conquer, and a steely resolve to eat right. The saving grace could be a scattershot of probiotics.

  8. LaFrite says:

    On a slightly parallel note, I started to add inulin to my crêpes dough :)

    __ 200g of flour mix:
    3/4 buckwheat
    1/4 wheat free flour mix (potato, rice, tapioca I think)
    __ 3.5 / 4 cups of whole milk
    __ 4 large eggs
    __ 2 Tbsp macadamia oil
    __ 4 Tbsp inulin / FOS powder
    __ garlic / onion / paprika powder
    __ salt to taste (herbal salt is good for that)

    * Mix all dry ingredients together
    * beat eggs, add oil and mix
    * add egg mixture to dry mix and mix
    * add milk and mix until smooth
    * warm up a flat pan, add butter and make crêpes (thin, this is not the thicker pancakes).

    Enjoy some warm, put some in the fridge and let them cool down. The day after, warm them up in the pan, add egg, grated cheese, ham, close the crepe and let it cook a bit. Enjoy with apple cider.

    • leo delaplante says:

      LaFrite,,buckwheat in itself is a great source for RS,i make 100% buckwheat bread using water and kefir milk and setting aside for 12 hours to perment,,i also use buckwheat and water to make soba noodles

    • Marybeth says:

      @leo delaplante
      Could you please post your recipe for your buckwheat bread. Thanks.

      I have post nasal drip and cough every morning and evening. I have tried just about everything and nada! I have been on RS since January along with SBO probiotics and make my own kraut, kimchi and beet kvass. I consume kvass every day and alternate with the kraut and kimchi (also carrots and gobo). I tried oregano oil with EVOO. I did that for a week and noticed nothing. Any ideas!?

    • Leo:

      And any other buckwheat recipes or ideas. Given my Russian Polish German ancestors, buckwheat is most likely a good thing for me

    • Marybeth,

      I will say this in the experience fixing my gut…I still had nasal drip and coughed out mucus 7 months left side and 12 months right side give or take both — then it just went away. i used the stuff below for 2 months

      You may also have stuff in your sinus , try seagates olive leaf spray a week then switch to nutribiotic grapefruit seed extract( back and forth) look them up.. you may need some extra power.. if its in your sinus , and your sleeping –its running down your throat at night…make sense ?? starting the process over?? I someone sleeps next to you have them look and see if you sleep with your mouth open all night and snore…may explain some.. mucus build up too
      both kill bacteria and yeast/fungus

      give it a try dont expect it to be instant thou–takes time.

    • leo delaplante says:

      Combine in bowl or pitcher:
      2 cups sour milk or buttermilk
      1 teaspoon salt
      1 tablespoon maple syrup, molasses, honey, or sugar
      1/2 cake compressed yeast (dissolved in water)(i used regular yeast)

      Add to mixture: enough buckwheat flour to make a thick batter (approximately 2 cups)

      Set mixture in a warm place to rise overnight. In the morning, add 1/2 teaspoon of baking soda dissolved in warm water.

      bake 375 for 30-40 minutes

      Save a little batter. Put it in the refrigerator. When you want to make something again, use the batter as a “starter” and no more yeast needs to be added. . i am now using kefir milk and leaving out the yeast and milk,,,i use maybe 1 1/2 cups of water and 1/2 cup of kefir milk for the liquids,,its a kind of sourdough bread,,you pour it into the pans(i use 2 banana bread pans) if you get a good rise omit the baking soda,,,its more of a cake/bread but sure does the job for egg breakfast and nut butter spreading,,,soba is water and buckwheat pressed and cut into noodles easy….

    • LaFrite says:

      Excellent, will try this very soon :)
      Thanks!

  9. GRACE can chime in here……

    Im going to post this for the 15 percent who may fell they haven’t seen a benefit — from RS as you may have more deep DOO DOO problems. THERE IS A TURE BENEFIT OF RS- its all laid out here for you Richard and Tator tot !!!!!!its just how bad are you screwed up from all those bad foods and tons of antibiotics you took over the years….Sometimes you cant bring a squirt gun to a house fire.

    Some of the best info on yeasts for some reason comes out of POLAND. When digging deep you’ll see the top experts even the ones at American gut , the wolfs etc and ones following the HAZDA tribe are MUM on yeasts/fungus . Its bacteria , bacteria ,and bacteria( would love to see the tribes fungus /yeast levels –Im sure they have almost none –compared to us westerners ) the only sugar they eat are some berries and real honey

    Some of you may need to hit the fibers harder, inulin etc when lowering yeast- to close the gut–and slowly feed bacteria before you attack some of the benefiting bacteria. (with tons of RS) as for me yeast preferred the starches ..(there gone now– the over a abundance of them) Probiotics — bifido and lacto and the soil based ONES appear to get you there.

    If you are one of these FEW.. maybe 15 percent , who maybe where I was — this guy (from POLAND–link at the end) has compiled the most data of anyone — he is a true expert in this area. ( like all the weirdo s , super low carb , paleo, High fat, and all the crazy diets –each thinks theirs is the best) But all can be used with success in my findings at stages to bring you along and back to health) fats, no carbs, inulin , fibers and starches..and good carbs. Things work at different rates or techniques due to the complexity of the gut make up bacteria/yeast balance – from years of bad eating(SUGARS) and antibiotics

    here is one of the longest READS— http://www.janus.net.pl/Candida%20Fungi.htm

    Dont get negative when he talks about starch–this again is the small percent so screwed up–its feeding the issue not helping

    Enjoy , again a long read….but will help you understand both sides of the
    ******* PLUS *******of RS sources feeding the GOOD bacteria , and for the few the negative people — feeding the yeast /fungus thats gone A-wall due to the MISSING bacteria … why advanced testing is import in the people who , dont succeed here at FREE THE ANIMAL dont blame the RS blame the yeast…..I learned this after spending thousands- and hopefully save you the CASH and time…. Get you bacteria up, and yeast down you will speed up the process faster,

  10. so any other source of parboiled rice besides Uncle Ben’s. I don’t like the added minerals in it…thanks

  11. tatertot says:

    Diane – Two options. Rinse the Uncle Ben’s, or, just get any old long-grain rice you like. The brown rices are probably quite a bit better as they have more fiber. On my bucket list is exploring the world of colored rice…black, purple, red. Anything with color naturally has more antioxidants and trace compounds. I actually made a big batch of wild rice from Minnesota the other day, not quite what I was expecting, but delicious!

    • leo delaplante says:

      tatertot,i have been eating potato starch since may of 2013 ,,last november
      i had a stool analysis done by doctor data,,if you care to see it i could email it to you,,you might remember me as i am the one that recommended buckwheat to you as a RS source

    • tatertot says:

      Can you just list the highlights here? Bifido, lacto, parasites, pH, or other biggies we talk about?

    • leo delaplante says:

      4+ bacteroids fragilis group
      3+ bifido
      2+ escherichia colis
      3+ lacto
      3+ enterococcus
      3+ clostridium

    • leo delaplante says:

      ph 6.4
      no parasites
      1+ candida albicans

    • tatertot says:

      How do you feel? Any problems? No parasites, good commensals, lowish pH. C. albicans is considered a part of normal flora.

    • leo delaplante says:

      i feel so much better than 1 1/2 years ago,i was metabolic and changes had to happen,,i lost 35 lbs and gained 8 back ,the weight gain happened after i started exercising last sept/2013 ,3 times per week HIIT for 20 minutes and strenght training on machines at the ynca,,i am 56 years old,,i have excellent and timely bowel movements,i do have hashimoto probably trigered by atkins 5 years ago(crashed my adrenals) follow PHD pretty strickly,all in all feeling just fine for my age

    • gabkad says:

      Tim, good quality wild rice is expensive but gorgeous. It can have a bit of smokey flavour. Not like smoked bacon. More like hardwood campfire smoke. Sort of like the smoke you smell from a distance from someone’s campfire.

  12. theres that nice friend 1+ candida albicans

    • leo delaplante says:

      on a scale of 1+ to 4+ is 1+ bad?

    • seeing the WORD “””” hashimoto “”””” Do some reading on them , GOOD that your better!!!! thou maybe add in some anti fungals( caplyric acid )
      stick to what your doing .Hey if your feeling better .. Your test results before when you were sicker or now when your feeling better???? It always stings we cant see the before and after ..

    • leo delaplante says:

      no before stool test ,i just learnt about stool tests 1 year ago,,this is all new to me but have learnt alot in last year,have you heard of black cumin seed oil,i take it everyday

    • Leo
      never heard of it…WHERE DO YOU get this stuff?? Man if we could have seen your STOOL before when you were sick :( high yeast low bacteria…..

      but Black cumin seed essential oil, as a potent analgesic and antiinflammatory drug http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15103664
      which may explain some added bonus help for you.. and L@@K below
      ***THE PART THAT HAS ME ALLJACKED*******

      YOU READY –In 2003, one study noted the antifungal activity of black cumin seed extract against Candida albicans. In the study, mice were injected with Candida albicans, producing colonies of the organism in their liver, spleen, and kidneys. The researchers found that treatment with black cumin seed extract 24 hours after inoculation inhibited growth of the Candida albicans. With continued treatment, the extract significantly decreased the amount of Candida albicans found in the kidneys, liver, and spleen.

      theres alot of good stuff in it never heard of it as well
      myristic acid
      palmitic acid
      palmitoleic acid
      stearic acid
      oleic acid
      linoleic acid (omega-6)
      linolenic acid (omega-3)
      arachidonic acid
      protein
      thiamin
      riboflavin
      pyridoxine
      niacin
      folacin
      calcium
      iron
      copper
      zinc
      phosphorous
      http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G2-3435100100.html

    • leo delaplante says:

      1 1/2 year ago i started my health journey,i wasnt sick sick i had metabolic syndrome,i suspected candida after spit in glass test and pubmeded candisa to find out about black cumin seed oil,i found out it helps candida from not spreading to vital organs,so i started takin it,,its very inexpensive to buy,,i also take amla and nobiletin,,,along with PHD recomended supplements,,

    • Leo ,
      Thats great—- an example why I jump in… I wouldnt be surprised if the hashimoto was from the over load of fungus…. and your lowering it while Uping your bacteria… the fight for your RS the bacteria are now winning.

      Which brand do you use??? liquid — have you tried to use caplyric acid pills too??? cheap at 13.00 Now foods is a good brand

    • leo delaplante says:

      my naturopath put me on some pills for candida but she wasnt concerned it was a big problem,,most everybody has it,,the cumin oil i take http://www.nationalnutrition.ca/detail.aspx?ID=5020 ,,look into nobiletin if you have time,,its not for candida,,

    • Leo,

      I ve looked at not to extensive but—I find it pretty strange it works on many skin problems
      respiratory, allergies —(respiratory / allergies = sinus Just a little odd
      dandruff it works on as well…?? is mainly fungus Theres alot of good acids in this stuff

      Nobiletin is an anti inflammatory

      Many herbalists in current times embrace the healing properties of black cumin seed extract. For example, the extract is sometimes used externally to treat such skin care problems as psoriasis, eczema , and dry skin, and internally to treat stomach problems, respiratory ailments, and allergies

      Pretty odd we will never know , to bad we didnt have a start dont with you…. theres many yeast/molds that can be pathogenic

      You have gluten issues??? or did you, milk or soy??? wondering , if you did or do are they better???

    • leo delaplante says:

      have not eaten gluten since jan 2013,gliadin thyroid thingy,,fermented dairy only no milk no soy,no seed oils ,sugars all a la PHD

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      The researchers found that treatment with black cumin seed extract 24 hours after inoculation inhibited growth of the Candida albicans. With continued treatment, the extract significantly decreased the amount of Candida albicans found in the kidneys, liver, and spleen.

      theres alot of good stuff in it never heard of it as well
      myristic acid
      palmitic acid
      palmitoleic acid
      stearic acid
      oleic acid
      linoleic acid (omega-6)
      linolenic acid (omega-3)
      arachidonic acid

      It’s actually well known that fatty acids inhibit the growth of candida. Normally the fatty acids that keep candida at bay come from our flora fermenting fatty acids from dietary fibers.

      Regulation of Candida albicans Morphogenesis by Fatty Acid Metabolites

      And truthfully, it’s not all that surprising when you understand that acids switch off the candida growth gene and turns candida from its filamentous hyphal form to its benign yeast form — literally like a light switch.

      Alkalinity promotes Candida overgrowth

      Our ancestors ate copious amounts of fibers, and their intact gut flora naturally made the acids necessary in the gut to keep candida in its benign yeast form and prevent it from becoming pathogenic.

    • eddie~ ur posts just make me smile!

    • Duck,

      I never cook my potatoes without cumin.

      My friend with psoriasis hates it and claims cumin makes him bloated.

      Make love , not war.

    • DUCK,

      exactly , I eat a high fat diet, plus krill , flax coconut etc…. but I eat tons of inulin and fiber veggies …. moving to the RS soon

      I say the fats have been killing off all my candida even thou they say they switch to fat… at the same time closing my gut and slowly feeding the bacteria –with fibers

      If your all low carb — fats with no fibers your killing your gut bugs we see that in the WACKO world of LC all fat like Jimmy moore- but he doesnt have heart disease from everything im doing , he produces fatty chain acids you would think he would have dropped dead from eating sticks of butter…I think hes killed off alot of good bacteria — but the fats seem to be antimicrobial — just my thoughts
      from whats happening to me. NOT saying LC is good just a tool in the shed to switch and fix your problems

    • leo, where did you find nobiletin? locally in Toronto?

    • leo delaplante says:

      the only place i can find nobiletin is in Sytrinol which is a patented blend to lower cholesterol,i cannot find it by itself http://www.nationalnutrition.ca/detail.aspx?ID=5140

    • leo delaplante says:

      in Sytrinol which is a patented blend to lower cholesterol,i cannot find it by itself http://www.nationalnutrition.ca/detail.aspx?ID=5140

    • Thanks leo!

    • Leo,

      And I suppose you know , the proteins in milk, soy and gluten can look like yeast to the body when the immune system is a mess from yeast…
      Did you have alot of problems with these foods before… once you go really sick

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      eddie,

      From your comments, it’s unclear to me if you are avoiding starches or not. Fats and fibers alone will not fix the gut barrier.

      Starches are a major ingredient as the human body spends the majority of its expended energy building and maintaining its own glycome — a collection of roughly 2,000,000 different kinds of sugar molecules (glycans) that are glycosylated to various proteins and lipids throughout the body.

      For instance, Mucin-2, the main glycan in your intestines that comprises your gut barrier, is 80% sugar by weight. If you don’t consume enough glucose, your body has to create its own glycans (like Mucin-2) from gluconeogenesis (or at the very least, intestinal gluconeogenesis). It’s an expensive metabolic process for the body and one that is not done easily when one’s immune system is compromised.

      Anyone who thinks they are starving yeasts by avoiding starches is oblivious to the fact that flora and yeasts will simply eat the gut barrier if they want to consume sugars that aren’t present in the diet.

      Furthermore, if one avoids eating starches and the liver is unable to keep up with the body’s demand for glucose production, glucose production will fall short and cause a glucose deficiency. The most obvious sign of glucose deficiency is dry eyes and low mucus production — a clear sign that the body is unable to keep up with the demands of its own immune system.

      Even if you are consuming high fat and fibers, including lots of RS, that still would not replenish one’s glucose reserves, and the deficit of glyconutrients would still be present.

      The lesson here is that your immune system requires glucose and anyone whose immune system is compromised will have a particularly difficult time glycosylating mucin and the 2,000,000 other glycans in the human glycome if they starve their body of exogenous glucose.

      People with yeast/candida issues can do extremely well eating 150g of starches per day — which is equivalent to a whopping 1 pound of potatoes/rice.

      From a macronutrient perspective, it’s about 30% carbs, 55% fat and 15% protein — reminiscent of the macronutrient ratios of human milk (39% carbs, 55% fat, 6% protein) — something that Richard has talked about many times here. I have no yeast reactions from doing so, and I find — like many others — that it simply makes the immune system more robust.

      And why shouldn’t it? If an infant is born with a leaky gut, it uses a similar approach to seal up its gut and build up its immune system.

      My apologies if you are already aware of this, but you seem to be mostly talking about fat and fiber and I think it’s important to understand the role of starches in supporting the immune system and the human glycome.

      Cheers.

    • Duck,
      many will say OH GOD another long post :)
      but hear me out…PEOPLE

      You DUCK!!!!!, have a lot of knowledge my friend. Everything you stated here is true. I understand that and fully know this.. I understand your point on flora eating the gut barrier etc. I know all this. and know everything you explain here..But you have to understand and learn my point and my personal experience and “””experiment”””People like Tator I see are now experimenting with other good foods (in the end its fixing everything with good real foods and we all know that!!!! but some dont except that cheating eating tons of what i call”” candy”” fruits thinking well its fruit its healthy ill eat more!!!!) yes to a point –but sugar is sugar–to much is not good. Now fats have there place too , good fats and sources…You will store sugar more then fat… I have eaten LOW LOW carb –I have been a meat eater… I dont eat sticks of butter like JIMMY MOORE.. I dont go crazy like ROB WOLF -paleo. many are super extreme and why they dont work!!!!! But I have taken steps back and looked at everyones side. They are all a piece of the puzzle , SAME WITH RS- we see it and we know it (YOU NEED IT) It helps gut bugs….people ate roots and berries… we know fat too.. the paleo well theres just a strange mix there. The whole rap with these people many have gotten better and feel better(they dont know why). Well so do some on SCD , and here RS . But the problem is no one really looks at or digs far in the hole to see what there problem is..(yeah paleo works -for some–your more a less starving some bad things(or removing intolerance’s) Im sure a lot of people are here (FREETHEANIMAL) because they have tried many things , failing at LOW carb, atkins, Paleo etc. ( they come here it works, they may have had some low bacteria and jumped it up…and now feel like superman!!! and thats good!!!!.. For me I see the value here..(RS). using it for certain gut microbes..I also see the use of certain fats… etc..
      So me, you hear me chat up yeast, let me add in i had high HPHPA (Clostridia Markers) as well.. I can tell you I dont eat like many people—this is due to my experiment( like TATOR- you see the improvement), and I will tell you why. After getting sick – the docs told me immune suppressant drugs for the rest of my life…(suppressants -to turn off the immune system) , they gave me 4 strong different types of antibiotics , zyson, cipro, vancomycin, some other and amoxicillin. Due to a gut problem( never took the immune drugs as many in my family tree did and there DEAD it didnt help them …Later my problem moved to a fistula( which I could talk and write a 1000 words–As I know I caused it no time to explain) the fistula .. Any way also part of my experiment.

      Laying There in a hospital bed ,I realized these ass holes had no idea what they were doing, I also noticed many other things changing worse my sinus, eyes , skin etc. I finally called the nurse and said no more– pull this crap IV out of my arm. Let me say also say I had,many things all my life sinus, dry skin on feet, blood shot eyes when tired , nasal drip, bad snoring , sensitive stomach, hemorrhoids all my life starting at 5, had countless surgery for them, 6 months later there back.. random nose bleeds (always from ENT, your nose is dry –yeah I have nasal drip??sure) I had my nose cauterized 8 times(first time 6 years old…tied down with a hot poker 1979(nothing for pain)I had it 8 times until they burned a hole thru the middle (at 15 years old with the new laser(i have a plastic button) today Im 41 I had it up to 38 . Ive had my lower GI scoped about 6 times from 14 to 38 each time finding nothing…??? you look good..
      Colon excellent, GI tract good,, just some hemorrhoids

      I began to look into the barrier , and foods , bacteria’s and yeast… You hear me talk about several tests — Its like a broken record. Now I researched all angles ,By trade I am an engineer (network) there are 7 layers and I looked at my body that way.. ( you dont skip and jump in the middle or top like docs, you start at the bottom)physical –wires, then data , then network, transport etc etc up to the top applications.. even in my field people are clueless server guy always says its the network…90 percent its the server. but you have to start at the bottom and work up(slowly)

      For me you hear me say ELISA ACT/ bio , I tested here and POTATO came back very bad, same with all dairy and some minor things– this tests IGM,IGA,IGG, TCELL and IMMUNE COMPLEX RESPONSES. a very detailed and good test…(for your immune system—not like the basic allergy office prick or caprast tests) I also did the enterolab test,,, I came back in fecal IGE testing VERY BAD to POTATO , MILK, CORN, RICE and some others.. What I noticed was starches??? WHY?????I would say my diet my whole life was mainly starches , grains, fruit and veggies , I ate well. taking in RS2 and RS3.. I have done many tests. What I have found is I cant find anyone who has done what I have done doing all of them and using them together. I cant list all of them, I have more…. I can tell you I dont have celiac but I do carry genes for HLA DQ —–and I have 4 that doesnt mean I will get celiac, But I have a good chance for gluten intolerance.(and this happen to me at 38 You only need 2 one from A and one from B I have 2 copies.. in the HLA DQ area …if people are interested google DQ2 and DQ8 you will understand

      Now to answer your comments on barrier… Some how , I can say , from testing in my many forms I was over loaded with yeast… I also can say – I had a problem with dairy(immune system.) and soy…as well STARCHES(fecal and immune)…but, when you dig in deep , and I cant explain it all here in this short long writting… look at the RS starch video on FEED THE ANIMAL.. what do bacteria do they ride the non digestible starch. What I can say is I know from all the antibiotics , and Im sure I had a problem since 4 years of age startig some then.. a low gut barrier( but worse when It fully failed…. I point to yeast as this runs in my family type 2 , colitis , and crohns dating to the first person in 1890′s. My testing points to high yeast..and a low gut- barrier some low and missing strains…. if starch is NON digestible ??? I would say it leaked in my gut(taking that ride) and my immune system then built antibodies to it.(which I see from testing)..stamping it as bad..Same with yeast,,Yeast live deep in the barrier—making roots when pathogenic..poking holes…You also have akkermansia that are in your barrier , since I was over loaded with them(yeast) and no bacteria(My inulin buddies-akkermansia were low..)..food proteins that look like yeasts/molds are soy ,milk (casien)and gluten…The candida protein This protein, called Hyphal Wall Proetin-1 or HWP-1 looks like gluten proteins, alpha gliadin and gamma-gliadin found in gluten products (Wheat, barley, rye)ones immune system cant tell the difference-(this knowledge is not easily found …I built antibodies to these foods and yeast… If I ate this food my body thought it was yeast….. yeast also eat sugars and starches. ( advanced IBD expanded panel- testing showed high sugar markers and super high AMCA markers for AMCA—amca can be to many mannons , candida etc… Removing all factors .. I watched this antibody (nothing a doc would do, they dont understand this ) this test is also given one time.. for GI testing…I did it every 3 months for 2 years) the food source was sugars…ALCA — and the problem AMCA candida. people fight and may say well… AMCA can be other things—other tests back this up as well as removing the other things making AMCA.(foods).. When you see a person who has gluten problems–unless you experience you will see the options are more starches, corn rice and potato—beans and fruits…. these people dont get better– and wont. they fell better not eating gluten– if there gut is a wreck , dont you think the non digestible starch enters??? well this appears to be my idea…and what Im seeing. When ever it was damp , my sinus was worse…( why you can have yeast in your sinus tract… if you made antibodies then they bug you here too. A thunder storm coming I got a migraine.. (due to pressure from sinus…What people dont know also is you can have an immune RESET– please look this up.. (you can start over like a baby eats for the first time) learning to re eat
      At the same time people will say but your problem is no good bacteria,,,, having the good bacteria will keep your yeast in check..yes but not so easy… yeast dropped the PH so low bacteria could not grow or function..(a conman problem with GI sick people–here take the purple pill–wrong) what do they do give them more antibitocs to kill the bad bugs.. but gone goes the good bugs—-your stuck in the circle…if you cant eat dairy, soy, gluten and starch gives you joint pain(i ended up with joint pain) and nose bleeds what do you eat… I ate low carb and fats… Where does this fit in the immune reset….. I gave my system time to heal , rest and reset, removing all these foods.. SOY, GLUTEN STARCH , GRAINS and excess sugars…the fats and oils are also very good for you… This is useless if you dont track and find your source and causes..(why good tests immune system and sttol and oat tests are good)
      I then worked on killing and lowering yeast(main issue), fixing some bad bacteria.. at the same time I worked on the gut closing it…with inulin foods to feed akkermansia bacteria. I say as the yeast lowered these guys took there place(traded)… as my gut got better… I was able to eat things like NUTs..(my stomach got quite). I should not be able to eat any( i have crohns) I regularly eat tons of (almonds , pumpkin and walnuts…fibers!!!!) my guess some starch there– yeast do not eat these. I also eat lots of cucumbers. I wont explain all my foods , I eat a diet, 1/2 veggies lots –but low starch ones, i eat meats , chicken etc…fish.. but suspect i get some RS – I eat julian bakery paleo bread –high in psyllium …I RS get from some sources. As time has gone on my PH has moved up…the yeast problem seems to be gone.. I can post many example reports..I have many.. Today my bacteria is growing and rising. I have proof of this in many tests. I test my self(foods) but not often , to see If I can eat gluten, starch, and some dairy( I didnt do this for 1.5 years). Now that my bacteria is up I can.. I can not do soy. I plan to retest my IMMUNE system in advanced testing in two weeks. from here I will learn if the immune system has reset. If it has which Im sure it has , I will then be testing fecal….to see what the response is there(in the gut)…Im sure this will be clear as well. I say this….as I know my barrier is thick with akkermansia bacteria. I also do not have mucus in my stool which I have had all my life. This bacteria thickens the barrier and also EATS mucus….now from testing I actually test my self and can eat HOT sauce with no problems…any spicy food??? I can drink beer… Im no drunk but actually drank my self silly 3 days in a row– to see the effects (drinking 8 beers each day on my gut) I dont drink..(i did up to 38, but nothing like that —-social) I also took extra probiotics at night when I drank… I felt fine and so did my gut.. My friends who drink all the time , didnt fare so well???? headaches… the runs… me fine…

      So , my story is — RS is good… but my timing BAD… Am I ready for it, I would say yes, will it help my gut bugs yes it will, Do I get some now…a little….Are The extreme low carb people are crazy–yes…eating butter sticks well??? I have slowly built back my microbiome I appear to have gained alot… using many things spirulina cyanobacteria… my probiotics kimch , kraut –yeast killers… vitamins etc…My focus now is to return the actinobacteria, which soil probiotics and RS should help… My BIFIDO is good , nothing like tators !!!! I really lack in lacto….

      Hope this explains some DUCK..

      and the sugar I get some from certain veggies I eat. I have tracked my sugar using my fitness pal. all my metobolic panels and blood panels show normal… MY nmr lipo shows excellent insulin resistance.. super low risk…

      long but hope people understand , with a BAD gut RS can be bad…DONT BASH RS unless you know your body , and problem, it is up to you to seek out your cause. doctors will treat your symptoms. From my 2.5 years logging documenting , having alot of gluten genes , I feel , at least in my family tree yeast is the true cause, and maybe for most of the world — followed by starch leaking in.. due to a bad start in life low bacteria… allowing the yeast to thrive( kids now have bad sugar diets) and the up tick of antibiotics (some which are yeast/molds) up ticking the immune s response /antibodies. My case maybe extreme– but I have almost completely fixed it—and all my docs are lost.. you also see the up tip of diabetes–which ,when you dig deep many point to fungus…

    • tatertot says:

      Dang, Eddie! Quite the manifesto…I hope everyone that is working their way through serious gut issues takes the time to read it.

      What Eddie is saying, is that you have to be your own doctor, but lucky for us we have Eddie. Eddie didn’t have an Eddie, he did it all on his own, and for that, I’m impressed.

      “By trade I am an engineer (network) there are 7 layers and I looked at my body that way.”

      Yep, I know all about the 7 layer salad of OSI networking, that’s a great analogy. I’ll bet the similarities you found were unsettling…I do systems integration and years ago, they taught us that when we connected to the network, it became IT’s problem. Then IT would blame us for it not working, we’d spend days/weeks troubleshooting and, lo and behold, it was an IT problem.

      Then we started getting training up to the data link level (2?), which took dumbass IT guys out of the picture for most issues, but we still ran into problems.

      Now all the integration techs get trained up to the application level, and that took IT completely out of the picture…all we need from them now is an IP address and we are done with them.

      Sort of like you, you trained yourself right up to your own operating system and you don’t need IT anymore.

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Yikes, Eddie. Had no idea you’ve been through so much. More power to you for taking matters into your own hands. Good luck to you!

    • Duck,

      Thanks!!! I see the value of RS….I see some people jump on here and BASH it —saying I gained weight over bad gas blah blah blah— you have to know your gut ans issues , before you can bash something RS has great value– you see my story , I ate low carb– but as a tool …I DONT bash RS , Im working up to it

    • Tator,

      I find the gut like the network …and the docs and GI docs like different departments all clueless. finger pointing.. The GI ‘s are pointing to the network…. ( there like application/server people) they have no clue where to go…but its the network…some of them have the tools- there just not using them correctly or talking to another departments.

      theres many tools a network guy uses , sniffers etc but in the end it can be a simple thing ( but the application people make it harder as there never wrong( AKA the GI — with a big head)

      one day I will walk into my GI’s office to say hi in an appointment ” hi remember me”” I never took the immune drugs and I am fine……. . I will give him a piece of my mind.— looking at GOOD bacteria may be a good start as well yeast….. Dont focus on just bad bacteria. rebuild the immune system instead of tearing it down….. and turning it off..

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      eddie sez:

      For me you hear me say ELISA ACT/ bio , I tested here and POTATO came back very bad, same with all dairy and some minor things– this tests IGM,IGA,IGG, TCELL and IMMUNE COMPLEX RESPONSES. a very detailed and good test…(for your immune system—not like the basic allergy office prick or caprast tests) I also did the enterolab test,,, I came back in fecal IGE testing VERY BAD to POTATO , MILK, CORN, RICE and some others.. What I noticed was starches??? WHY?????I would say my diet my whole life was mainly starches , grains, fruit and veggies , I ate well. taking in RS2 and RS3.. I have done many tests. What I have found is I cant find anyone who has done what I have done doing all of them and using them together. I cant list all of them, I have more…

      eddie, sorry to ask, but it sounds like you got these elaborate allergy tests done and actually believed that you were allergic to the things that were highlighted on the tests.

      Surely you must know that those allergy tests are unreliable and pretty much worthless. If not. Read these links, just for starters:

      http://www.allergycentre.com.my/unproven.html
      http://www.betterhealthusa.com/public/282.cfm

      Allergists and doctors who know their shit don’t even use those blood tests due to their unproven and terribly unreliable results.

      Those article I linked to explain in detail many of the well known problems with those tests. The big issues can be summarized by this exchange on a podcast with Chris Kresser and Kurt Harris:

      From: Episode 6 – Kurt Harris on orthorexia, meditation, lipids & more

      Kurt Harris:…The problem with this IgG testing and any kind of antibody testing is that when you have — I also have a problem with the term “leaky gut” because people mean different things by it, but when you have actual leakage of tight junctions and things going into your bloodstream, you can have an immune response mounted to almost any of those molecules going through there. The correlation of the immune level response or finding the antibodies with the clinical effect is poor to nonexistent, meaning if they tested me, they might find some level of detectable antibodies to lamb and beef because I live on lamb and beef, but that wouldn’t mean that I’m having any particular symptom due to that. So, that’s how some people get in a bind. Not only are they convincing themselves they’re having problems, but then they get testing done, which is bogus, that reinforces that they really are allergic to everything, and actually maybe they do have leaky gut, but the problem is the leaky gut, not the particular things that are leaking.

      Chris Kresser: Exactly. Or maybe they had leaky gut and those larger molecules slipped through, created an immune response six months ago, and those IgG antibodies are still there because they last for three to six months, but the body already repaired that damage long before…

      …I don’t know if you’ve heard stories like this, but I had a colleague who drew his own blood on the same day, marked the vials with two different bogus names, and sent them into the same lab. He got back completely different results. One was, like, if you eat peanuts you’re gonna die, and then the other one was, like, go ahead and eat peanuts, no problem.

      Basically, all those tests show — if they were even reliable/accurate — is that you had/have a very leaky gut. They are pretty much useless beyond that. And, as Dr. Harris points out, if you buy into those tests, and believe their results, you can end up creating an orthorexic response and create your own allergic responses just by believing that they will happen (like a nocebo effect).

      I’d hate to see you recommend those tests to people when in fact all those tests do is confuse people and send them down the wrong paths.

      The gold standard way to know if you have a food intolerance is to do an elimination diet for 30 days and slowly add the food in question back in.

    • Duck,

      First you have to know what testing your talking about IGG testing is unreliable!!! and worthless…you are pointing to this..THIS IS A WASTE OF MONEY…..same to me with the allergy office for many with gut problems ,If you been here( I have) you ll see 80 percent are tossed under the bus and told your allergic to nothing,,, yet there sick???? they tell you to do a FOOD MAP or chart your food. They say Im so sorry!!!!! We get this all the time…chart out your food… The problem is I call bullshit as you can have a reaction 3 days after you eat something so marking your food is a joke.

      So I eat rice–monday mark my food, I feel bad 3 days later , Oh was it one of the 9 meals I ate in 3 days???? what I had last night???or for breakfast ???wrong you will never know!!!!!

      here is what Im talking about THE CREAM of the crop….PLEASE READ LINKS FULLY
      http://www.elisaact.com/pdfs/EAB_Diagram_AllergyPaths.pdf
      the only tests that measure all three types of delayed sensitivity reactions through lymphocyte activation: <——-key words here

      1) Reactive antibody (IgA, IgM, and IgG)
      2) Immune complexes
      3) T cell direct activation
      http://www.elisaact.com/nonhc/our-unique-testing-method.asp
      This is not IGG testing–this IGG alone is BAD

      Sorry but if you believe everything CHRIS KRESSER says than GOD HELP YOU!!!!! he is right here on IGG thou

      My point in all of my testing—is I had CROHNS DISEASE and ULCER COLITS……there is no cure for it???? If so CHRIS IS THE MAN..????and should tell everyone in the world how to get rid of it…theres millions with it- he should be the FACE of AMERICA

      Now I dont have crohns or do I have ulcer colitis–I took no DRUGS that the GI says to take.( I rebuilt my microbiome that was the answer) Now the test above found I had reactions in my immune system as well the LAME O IGG and some others. This test tests all them. SEE ABOVE 1-3

      So in the end using this test, and a fecal test IGE only ( same antibody they use at the allergy office but here in your POO) and the IBD EXPANDED PANEL AMCA ACCA ALCA ASCA antibodies and several other tests!!!!

      I can tell you this,, I had crohns , my gut leaked, the cause was CANDIDA yeast( no standard doc or gi knows shit here)… the Yeast kept my PH low…No good bacteria would grow or stick,,, Candida being in charge , it lowered my akkermansia bacteria.. swapping places(no akkermansia equals no gut lining)… the yeast caused the holes that allowed the NON digestible starches to leak in making me sick and creating immune reactions.. (rice ,corn, potato etc) with the yeast in charge and causing a leak into my system which can be microscopic ( your GI cant see with his POO SHOOT camera lower GI) .. OVERLOAD of yeast I created antibodies to yeast… so everything I ate gluten , I got more sick, same with milk and soy….as the proteins look the same. The antibotics contributed to the cause, and added the immune response to YEAST/mold(amoxicillin)

      In the end I closed the gut—- building up akkermansia bacteria , while KILLING YEAST… once this happen my PH went up and I started an environment bacteria liked again
      most of all my bacteria is coming back….and now I have no yeast problems— NO CROHNS and no doctor can understand why??? I can drink a shit load of beer, eat a 6 donuts if I want…wheat bread , and drink milk????? no problems… I have 4 genes for gluten issues , weekend and watched the WORLD CUP…felt great… Now I have lost all DOCS

      Why I want to write my own book on my experience ( the microbiome is more then what doctors know,,, yeast is very important as well as bacteria in health,
      YOU WILL NOT GET ONE GI TO SAY CANDIDA YEAST CAUSES DISEASE OR CROHNS…

      For my case —-and all those problems I listed they were the symptoms of what happen from yeast…

      I hope I didnt come off nasty I get so excited typing!!!!! and dont proof read many times..I get excited about my gut and where its come.

    • As well,,,,, bad bacteria over grew with all the use of antibiotics….killing the good and allowing the yeast to grow even more — bacteria also leaked in and gave me a fistula…. With all the mess — they just put me in a circle—– antibiotics become a temp immune system for docs — tossing them at you.. when you have killed the good bacteria , that should do the job…

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      eddie,

      For what it’s worth, the ELISA/ACT shows up on QuackWatch as being a scam. Now, I don’t believe everything QuackWatch says, but…

      The test is incredibly expensive (~$800 before lab fees). So, most people would be better off simply following an elimination diet. Would be a lot cheaper and is far more reliable.

      Nothing worse than being told you can’t eat something, in error, just because an unproven lab makes a mistake with unproven diagnostics.

    • Duck,

      I can understand your opinion ,,,so let me explain When I was fully sick , I had every test under the sun by my GI doc , he did all gluten tests, he checked many vitamin levels CRP level sed rate all metobolic panels.. He did what every GI does— check about 7 bacteria and call it a DAY as well and hand full of parasites,

      In the process , he tested the IBD PANEL– this tests
      Atypical perinuclear antineutrophil cytoplasmic antibodies (pANCA); Saccharomyces cerevisiae, IgA;
      Saccharomyces cerevisiae, IgG
      This is a gold standard test— for the following
      if you get sick your going to get this test for

      Bowel Disease
      Crohn Disease
      IBD
      Ulcerative Colitis
      This basically is testing antibodies for YEAST many diseases you will find test these same antibodies ????? why ????? Many argue that if you eat alot of yeast this can be high…so its for quacks. So this should be on quack watch??? For some reason they use it. I tested NEGATIVE HERE—didnt help me

      If your GI is good he will investigate more (90 percent dont and go straight to the GI camera up your ass and down your throat.
      A good doc will run the IBD EXPANDED PANEL (EXPANDED) Now this tests many antibodies ALCA AMCA ASCA and ACCA PANCA Each antibody mean some according to FOODS / types and yeasts. Bacteria can also look to the body as food–as some proteins etc look the same. Yet almost NO one uses this.???? why same as what people would say on quack watch..Why use it??? Some will say well alot of people are high in ASCA= bakers / brewers yeast.. So then why do they use it????

      So all these people who are sick
      Bowel Disease
      Crohn Disease
      IBD
      Ulcerative Colitis
      They get no answers ??? Why I am I sick, so doctor then tells them to go to the allergy office IGE antibody testing is what this is called.. they prick your arm draw little circles. If nothing comes back then they can send the blood out same antibody IGE (CAPRAST) Most of the people above come back with NOTHING???? Yet there sick??? SO the allergy office should also be listed in quack watch ??? correct?? It doesnt work??? It did not work for me..I came back negative for every thing tested.. even milk yet my lips were tingling. I also had a lactose test , negative.
      So the GOLD STANDARD from here is list out your food…So then why use IGE testings???

      So in STANDARD GI testing I have NO bad bacteria, no parasites and Im allergic to no foods???? But Im sick??I guess I am and all the others we are all quacks??? The quacks are the Doctors there answer is to give you Immune suppressants drugs to turn off the immune system and loads of antibiotics to fight something 80 percent of the time they have no clue what there fighting

      So what i found is my doctor also tested me for HLA Disease association – he told me I was positive but didnt tell me anything about it. Or why??? On my own I learned HLA deals with genes..SO I went ahead and genetic tested– my results showed 2 genes for
      sleeping problems, 2 for type 2 diabetes and 5 genes total for gluten intolerance 2 full copies A and B you need an Alpha and Beta I have 2 of each plus 1. I find it interesting my genes match up with problems in my family tree.

      So one other test. the IBD EXPANDED PANEL… my doc told me I was High in ALCA and AMCA, no reasons or did he tell me what these meant. I was told Immune drugs to turn off my immune system for the rest of my life??? many others in my family got this to… there all dead.. they all died before 68. im sure the 15 or so people in the docs office that day got the same drugs of choice my doc likes to use.
      So back to ALCA —-break this out its not easy , break out all the foods it will take you hrs/ months , as well Do the same for AMCA no easy task. Look up yeasts and as well bacteria.

      So this IBD EXPANDED PANEL… This is usually given ONE time. I have tested this panel every 3 to 4 months for 2.5 years. What I found as my antibodies lowered my disease went away??? Why ??? Can you tell me???
      I know , because I can tell you what foods and groups/ types fall under all the antibodies lisedt for the IBD EXPANDED PANEL ACCA ,ALCA,ASCA AMCA.

      So I had high antibodies and Im sick, yet theres no cause for my sickness and gut failure???
      So the elisa act, What you will learn is not everyone responds to the same antibodies. there are many some mean past or ongoing infections (IGG) early infections IGM etc current etc etc,… SO the IGE allergry office near you house should also be in quakwatch. same with the IBD tests. If you dont respond to IGE and have to write out your food then its a quack test.

      So back to the IBD expanded panel and all the break outs.. When you dig deep , you will find experts say the body can be broken in two BLOOD reactions(and theres many) and GUT reactions.. why??? well if your gut leaks your going to have more blood reactions or if your body creates antibodies. Same with the gut.. a Gluten Celiac person has a gut reaction…if you wipe wheat bread all over there arm there not going to die..cut there arm same problem,,, nothing the gluten touched there blood many will not drop dead.
      So the ELISA ACT bio….. what I found in doing my testing is the foods I came back matched the break out I found with the GOLD standard IBD EXPANDED PANEL–which should also be on quack watch??? At the same time , food for example potatos and buckwheat when I ate them made my nose bleed… at the local allergy office Im negative . at elisa act I am positive. Same with all yogurt and dairy.
      If you scan thru a standard lab Like lab corp or quest…Different antibodies for the same test…example candida blood test..????why why not IGE ??? Its a blood reaction. . SO fecal testing , you will find many people negative here as well… All the things that came back here matched as well my IBD EXPANDED PANEL… The elisa act /Bio test is a little different as it also tests many things IGM IGG IGA TCELL and IMMUNE COMPLEX. all at the same time. Id be happy to email my IBD EXPANDED PANEL results since this is not really on quack watch since it is the gold standard. theres 2.5 years worth and you can watch my antibodies go down. At the same time… removing these foods for up to 3 to 6 months can give your immune system time to heal ,rest and repair it self. Something you should look into to. Soon I will be retesting I already know I can tolerate many of those foods I could not before( a year ago).. They MADE me sick when I ate them….they also came up on the elisa act /bio —–and as well under the groups of antibodies in GOLD standard IBD panel testing.

      Please take the time to join a site like crohns forum ..poke around — you will see every one is basically a drug addict swapping stories on what meds to take(as over time—these crohns people get more sick as there body gets use to the immune drug(they then switch to a new one) deep down there out of balance of bacteria and yeast—and food is leaking in….you will also see that none of them get better.. there all doing food maps and elimination diets . They are all sick and dieing. With there elimination diets they will tell you they dont know whats making them sick.

      You can have your opinion, You are free to and I understand that. I can have mine… I feel the allergy office should be listed on quack watch as it doesnt work… its for instant allergies only

      One thing I state always is NOT to use one test to base your whole problem— what I have been saying is there are many tests -standard , non standard and questionable ones. using them all together you can get answers and good data.

      Now , your basing your RS on tators Ameican gut and stool tests..also well what a guy on american gut is saying about starch. How accurate is american gut and ubiome as well GDX… you see you get different results on all , so all these should be on quack watch???

      You see where im going??? its how you use it and interrupt it.. Many gut experts say ADHD is a gut problem yeast and bad bacteria ( all of these experts are called quacks) same with many yeast researchers they are called quacks.
      many may think Richard and tator are quacks.
      I dont see them as quacks…..Im sure you dont as well – its how you use and interpret the data
      You came to your opinion and conclusion on RS by using it etc…

    • figured I paste in my IBD EXPANDED PANEL
      FOR ALCA
      “negative less 45, Equivocal 45-50, Positive over 60
      FOR AMCA
      negative less 90, Equivocal 90-100, Positive over 100”

      Take a look at the year /month OCT 2013 then the next test FEB 2013 you will see a large drop in AMCA ( I took antifungal drugs here)

      March 2012
      ALCA 64 POSITIVE
      AMCA 204 POSITIVE
      gASCA 13 Negative
      ACCA 58 Negative
      pANCA tieter
      ____________________________________________________________________________________Oct 2012
      ALCA 40 Negative
      AMCA 184 POISITVE
      gASCA 14 Negative
      ACCA 23 Negative
      pANCA Negative
      _____________________________________________________________________________________
      Feb 2013
      ALCA 36 Negative
      AMCA 99 EQUIVOCAL
      gASCA 21 Negative
      ACCA 16 Negative
      pANCA Negative
      ____________________________________________________________________________________
      May 2013 NEGATIVE FOR ALL
      ALCA 35 Negative
      AMCA 74 Negative
      gASCA 13 Negative
      ACCA 16 Negative
      pANCA Negative
      _____________________________________________________________________________________
      Sept 2013 NEGATIVE FOR ALL
      ALCA 23 Negative
      AMCA 58 Negative
      gASCA 11 Negative
      ACCA 18 Negative
      pANCA Negative

      DEC 2013 NEGATIVE FOR ALL
      ALCA 37 Negative
      AMCA 74 Negative
      gASCA 11 Negative
      ACCA 16 Negative
      pANCA Negative

      April 2014 Negative for all
      ALCA 41 negative
      AMCA 85 Negative
      gASCA 2 Negative
      ACCA 23 negative
      pANCA Negative

      Looking at the last month, you will see AMCA ticking up, yet my other testing shows a decline of yeast… The up tip I believe the large amounts of cabbage and blue berries and guar gum from the almond milk I have added..many of my other tests show low yeast…So the up tip is Not yeast SO this test is should be on quack watch as its not reliable???
      what use is it if people have yeast or eat high mannose foods you cant tell ???? I can As I have limted my foods for testing purposes.

      AMCA can be many things….
      and I believe right now I know what the up tip is and it isnt candida YEAST….It was months ago…I ate a LIMTED DIET for 1.5 years..

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie,

      People’s allergies tend to change throughout life. More likely you just have a really leaky gut and all these foods that you should be able to tolerate are giving you problems. As you repair your gut, it could very well be feasible that you are able to tolerate normal foods.

      In that case, the foods on the ELISA/ACT printout aren’t the underlying cause of your problems. The reactions to those foods are likely just be a manifestation of a very leaky gut. One typically doesn’t need an $800 test to tell them they have a leaky gut.

      Now, I realize you were an extreme situation, but my point is that that kind of testing could easily confuse the average person into avoiding foods that they don’t actually need to avoid. Most people would probably do best by simply doing a 30 day elimination diet, and reintroducing foods slowly, while focussing on repairing their gut barrier with probiotics and prebiotics. No point in overcomplicating things we barely understand unless absolutely necessary.

      I’m not trying to invalidate your approach. Clearly it’s worked for you, and you should be proud of that. I’m simply pointing out that it doesn’t need to be that complicated for most people with gut problems.

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      eddie said:

      “figured I paste in my IBD EXPANDED PANEL
      FOR ALCA…FOR AMCA”

      I dunno eddie. It just seems like you are overcomplicating things with tons of tests that have never even been proven to be reliable. I just don’t see how you can put that much stock in the results. And I don’t see why the average person should subject themselves to what may be very unreliable testing every month. Seems like a waste of money and an unnecessary source of stress and obsession.

    • Duck,

      That is what I said……a leaking gut. In my past posst. My point , Your GI doesnt believe in this term as well… ( these people are so @ss backwards on the immune system, gut leaking , YEAST and what your GOOD bacteria levels are and where they should be… They also only look at a hand full of bacteria or parasites.

      My whole point is that ,I had a leaking gut….I know this..No doctor would tell me or well they dont believe in that. They dont believe in yeast as well.. If your gut is leaking , and I can prove mine was from yeast and low akkermansia bacteria .Which please read on this bacteria. <—— In this whole process eating NON digestible starches leaked in…Same with certain foods and proteins. I have had allergies , seasonal my whole life—they are now gone. In this process I realized antibiotics like amoxicillin add to many people allergies as one you create antibodies to it( mold/yeasts– 90 percent of us eat and drink tons of yeasts daily…and B you kill off more good bacteria. Many yeasts resemble the same proteins as certain foods. Once your body/immune system is overwhelmed- leaking gut or not. (Its also been proven almost all sinus issues are fungus related( the beginning stage). What Im saying is , from the start Im sure I had a fungus/yeast issues… antibiotics created a monster== leading to more allergies Sinus and ( well say leaking gut) Im going to say this…If you eat a peanut or drink milk and you get deathly sick or could die , this is an ALLERGY.. IGE testing is good for you. ( if no allergies you have choices) you can write it all down , you maybe lucky!!!! In the case of people with IBS etc they are not..

      From all the bad choices in life eating, many rounds of antibiotics , or living in a moldy home, you have degraded you immune system and added allergies.. ( sinus, gut- worn out leaky) Once your immune system is taxed… it cant do its daily job , hunting , blocking and attacking. Why so many get worse… I m not saying for every one to do my approach…

      ****************************************************
      WHAT im saying and I have said ——-EAT the """""""inulin foods"""""" –there feeding the gut and closing it….trust me !!!!! I have spent alot and tracked everything in detail. Take your probiotics , bifido… lactco and your soil based. Eat your good probiotics foods.. ( me Im not to keen on the milk) get your fiber, some good fats—feed your bacteria , with the RS.. If your not getting anywhere and you dont feel like your getting better , and you have many allergies odds are you have a leaking gut… why all this isnt working for you.

      If you feel that way– then many of the tests I say can help.( NO ONE base there health on one test) using many in conjunction will give you answers. There expensive yes some bash some of them, but from my experience , alot of the data I got from some that are questionable matches with go to tests.

      STAY AWAY from antibiotics If you can..if your not on deaths door then don't take them. If you do need them culture and prove why you need the type there giving you. (dont toss a dart a wall with your eyes shut)

      So in the end —–Im promoting INULIN for your gut,,, to speed up the process if your not getting anywhere –add in caplyric acid

      Do your probiotics, RS and eat your fibers….add some GOOD fats drop the excess SUGAR and in the end you wont NEED to spend a dime(like I did) on anything you ll live a HAPPY life…

      Still lost on the 800.00 test thu :) theres no one test for 800…

    • Man your not getting it…..Im not telling everyone to run out and do all the testing.. If someone is not doing well ,which is maybe 10percent of the population , We have some on here that point out they dont feel well eating RS—- odds are they have some big DOO DOO problems.. and that ONLY a few..

      You realize you can find a negative to any test , and as well a positive to every test if you want to. Please explain why a gastro would use the IBD panel and the IBD expanded panel ???

      Again your missing the point many of these tests are “”””investigational to diagnose inflammatory bowel disease””””

      you seem to have all the answers…. you should team up with a GI doc in your area and help all these people

      please take a look at the link below
      http://www.wjgnet.com/1007-9327/14/5115.asp

      I put stock in the results , because I dont have ulcers nor do I have crohns anymore.. and my stomach seems soild as a rock compared to my friends who dont have IBS etc Sorry man, but your far off in the crohns area.. Im not trying complicate things and make people confused..

      But for the small case of people— theres alot they can be doing then TAKING A DRUG to turn off the IMMUNE SYSTEM… if you have bad bacteria( well say roaches) If you have roaches in the basement…you tape the door shut , turn the lights off and cut the AC power .

      Well you still have a room full of roaches ???? this is the same with IMMUNE system drugs

      every thing I point to is to INVESTIGATE — if there was a answer , there wouldnt be IBS colitis and crohns… Duck you dont understand because you dont have it….if you ever end up with it you will….

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      WHAT im saying and I have said ——-EAT the “””””””inulin foods”””””” –there feeding the gut and closing it….trust me !!!!! I have spent alot and tracked everything in detail. Take your probiotics , bifido… lactco and your soil based. Eat your good probiotics foods.. ( me Im not to keen on the milk) get your fiber, some good fats—feed your bacteria , with the RS.. If your not getting anywhere and you dont feel like your getting better , and you have many allergies odds are you have a leaking gut… why all this isnt working for you

      Gotcha eddie. I guess it’s hard to tell what your message is with your exceptionally long posts. But, if that one paragraph sums up your message, then great. I think everyone here agrees with that summation — it’s pretty much what everyone’s been saying here for months. Sorry if I misunderstood you.

    • Ataraxia says:

      Actually Eddie, Duck seems to understand a hell of a lot more than anyone else from your voluminous cascades of disjointed information, colorful commentary and side-bars.

      He and others who have tried to wade through them and engage you in discussion deserve a lot of credit.

      You are laudable in your effort to share your experience in order to help others, but damn it, your communication style really sucks.

      I wouldn’t say anything if it weren’t for the fact you seem to be in earnest. Are you? A small effort at coherence would help you get your messages across.

    • Ataraxia,
      I am sincere, I respect Duck!!! I have even said at times– MY FRIEND YOU HAVE GREAT KNOWLEDGE. Tests in general are used to investigate. Why we have so many, more then half that are “standard “our general docs dont even understand. No one person is an expert at everything . (even Mr quack) on his quack site. When you read on him you see some questionable things as well.. DUCK has alot of knowledge I see it, read and hear it…

      I am sincere , and want people to realize, theirs more than just the RS… for me I see 3 areas , gut barrier( akkermansia) Yeast/fungus and GOOD bacteria-(RS RS RS)-and some small bad we need. I point to all this from having a family with a long history, and my self ending up a mess.

      If one has a bad experience with your Toyota corolla(bought brand new) that doesnt mean all toyotas are bad even that model. Same applies to testing. They are all tools non standard standard etc… RS is not going to help the whole world, Just like me running my mouth on inulin and yeast. But combined many things give answers.. Why people stand out and excel.

      You see ,I guess I don’t come across short, the Italian in me – you take someone like TATOR
      He is testing and testing and re testing, A1C bacteria ‘s etc , to show the world that there is something here in RS …No one else has done this, tracked logged watched his bacteria grow!!! We have learned a great deal. And we are learning more each day from richard and tator. With medicine we have learned to use it to turn off things, but no root causes are ever really found in many diseases. We are now seeing the gut and things that TATOR , scientists at American gut are showing that microbes are forming and playing with your system.

      I come across confusing at times, as I rant- but Im doing the same thing compiling data. Some of the tests are questionable to some- some experts see parts that are helpful while some exports point out the negatives. This can be said in all the gastro tests available standard or non. I at times question the Ubiome , great plans lab GDX and american gut. For me you see certain bacteria live in certain areas more. So if they dont ride the POO which a person explained to me, you cant necessarily get a true accurate reading. Why if you take sample of poo you may have different readings. You may have lacto in the moring, and none in the evening …when you do???? Or even send them different places. Tator will show us this more , I suppose in months to come when he gets all 3 back Amgut, Ubiome and GDX—– odds are they will be different. If they are Lets not all get upset!!!!
      Im doing the same thing– try to help and prove some points , as NO one can understand why I can function now normal , at the same time my fistula , which was 7 inches long about 5 inches deep across my @ss and hip healed fast. If I can do anything—-its to make sure PEOPLE get in them , diet, good bacteria, fiber RS –low yeast and RS will keep you going… If I can send my message ======= you will never see , fight , or go thru a nightmare– you ll get no answers for , just pills.

    • Duck,

      You are awesome, I have no hard feelings man–Im so happy you pointed that paragraph out :) I hope every one L@@KS Hard at it

      Just if you dont get away where you 10 % ers , dont rely on your GASTRO alone, Grace will tell you.. Its your job to Investigate using tests and methods , GI’s may have NO answers for you..at times

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Right on, Eddie. Keep truckin!

    • Ataraxia says:

      eddie, you are sincere…and incorrigibly incoherent.
      I give up, it’s charming in away.

      But….did you say Italian? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3DX9Ho83QI
      (in the spirit of incoherence ;-))

    • ataraxia,

      haha good thu funny!!!!!

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie,

      I was thinking about what you’ve said. You’re clearly on the right track for your situation.

      My thoughts are that — in overly general terms — there is nothing particularly special about Inulin or RS or any of the fibers for that matter. They all have their roles in the gut, and we probably need them all. My feeling is that fibers ferment to create SCFAs, (and other good metabolites), and these SCFAs lower the pH in the GIT, which is known to turn candida from a pathogen to a benign/harmless. Inulin is simply a single piece of the puzzle. It’s not a panacea. Same with RS. I don’t think anyone should get overly excited about one of the many fibers. There’s no point. I realize you get this, and I know you’re going to experiment with other fibers. That’s the kind of investigation we all like and hope you’ll keep us posted on your journey.

      But, from my view, it probably makes no difference if someone is eating a diet high in Inulin or high in RS or any fiber, so long as they are fermenting and have a decent set of gut bugs. It’s the fermentation that seems to matter most, not which fiber is “best” or which acid you can throw down your gullet. So, I see a variety of fibers as being a goal to work up to. I started with RS (it’s cheap and easy) and I’ve moved on to a wider variety of fibers. You’ll probably do the same. Let your gut bugs make those acids for you and maybe take a swig of ACV with meals.

      And as for macronutrients, I personally (as many others also do here) think there’s a wisdom in roughly mimicking the macronutrients in human breast milk to some degree. I think a certain amount of carbs probably assists with glycosylation of mucins and important glycans in the body, which in turn improves the immune response. RS from starches is a bonus (it’s not the only reason we eat starches). But, even if someone just eats virtually any significant quantity of fiber, it should inhibit pathogens (as you have shown with inulin).

      So, more power to you eddie! Keep up the good work and let us know how you do. There are a LOT of fibers to choose from. I think most will do us all some good.

      The other day I was in the store and found “raw mesquite powder” (Prosopis pallida). The label said it was high in fiber and claimed, “Mesquite pods have long been used by Native Americans, who ground them into a powder for use as a flour or sweetener”. Made me wonder if my gut bugs would like some :). Experimentation is the name of the game, and I see you’re well on your way.

      My thoughts are that our ancestors and their indigenous cultures ate a wide variety of fibers and their high-fermenting guts were just inhospitable to most pathogens. It didn’t matter if one group ate more Inulin and another ate lots more RS. It all probably helped by keeping their GITs acidic. So, that’s my bag. I’m not married to any particular fiber and hope you see it that way too. Inulin and RS are just ingredients that can help us close our own fermentation gaps.

    • Duck,

      I always like to see and hear what people have to say…. I to think its the fibers / inulin / rs depending on the gut bugs… your mix and we are all different

      The strange thing for me when I was a PH 5 i was a mess, now I am a PH of 7 , no problems,
      I eat tons of fibers from different veggies..plus massive inulin, nuts .

      I have a very strange make up now
      mainly
      Genus Bacteroides 37.3%0.19% 20x
      Genus Parabacteroides 20.1% Family
      Genus Akkermansia 13.2%

      But when I test , at say great plans, my yeast is no low , but my Bifido, Escherichia, Bacteriods Fragilis , clostridium look good at timew I have Lacto and Entero and at times I dont

      Seem to be making SCFA’s

      I have been reading alot into Bacteriods Fragilis and wonder if they work hand with others like Akkermansia

      Check out this study
      http://sfari.org/news-and-opinion/news/2013/friendly-bacteria-treat-autism-like-symptoms-in-mice

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie,

      Healthy individuals do not strive to have an alkaline colon. That would cause all sorts of issues and it would be an indicator of low fermentation of SCFAs.

      But, if you have Ulcerative Colitis, that is a different story. You will find this quote and link helpful, as well as the beautiful embedded chart, I’m sure (hat tip to tatertor)…

      From: Intraluminal pH in Ulcerative Colitis

      Intraluminal pH varies along the length of the digestive tract in a relatively predictable pattern. In healthy individuals, there is a progressive increase from the duodenum to the terminal ileum, a decrease in the cecum, and then a slow increase along the colon to the rectum. In patients with ulcerative colitis (UC), a similar but somewhat more acidic pattern is sometimes observed. Colonic pH during a UC flare can be extremely low, secondary to the accumulation of short-chain fatty acids (pKa = 4.8) and lactic acid.

      Notice the pH levels in the chart for most individuals and consider what the article says about extremely low pH in those with Ulcerative Colitis.

      So, you are talking about feeling worse with extremely low pH, which makes sense in the context of Ulcerative Colitis. For everyone else, the goal is make their colon mildly acidic by eating fiber and fermenting SCFAs — which in turn keeps pathogens at bay. A healthy individuals should not get too acidic by eating lots of fiber, and most people will feel amazing with a mildly acidic colon.

    • Duck,

      On my last post I had a type o “”I said no””…I meant now low…( yeast is gone) but my ph is higher 7

      I see the changes from 5 PH to 7 PH, For me I also appear to feel better with less Lacto bacteria…unless it is now staying in the upper areas where it should be… (maybe why I dont really see it in stool testing now–doesnt ride my poo down the highway) I eat alot of sauerkraut lactobacillus kraut and kimchi . My probiotic pill is 7 strains lacto (30 billion)and 3 strains bifido (20 billion) . my gut is perfect
      Make all the SCFA’s no inflammation etc
      I have tracked all my SCFA’s in testing( 2.5 years)as well Lysozyme , lacoferrin and many others

      When my PH was a 5 my lysozyme was 1310
      you should be under 600
      Today I am a lysozyme 97<—– Lysozyme is an enzyme secreted at the site of inflammation in the gi tract

      Same with Lactoferrin at a ph of 5 I was 15.8
      normal is under 7.3 Today at ph 7 I am 0.5
      lacteroferrin is also a gi marker used to detect inflammation in the gi area

      For me my main issue was crohns with secondary ulcer colitis… both gone and seem s for good.. I point to the yeast for the crohns(and can prove it with my case) and the low PH for the ulcer colitis.( the yeast keeping the ph low) Many argue well your in remission.( I didnt take any of the meds) they say You cant cure it
      I dont think so…I think you can, and after you put all the good sources of bacteria back(which I am slowly doing –diversifying my microbiome—Which from testing I never HAD), you will keep it in check. I point to the IBD panel as an example, when you look at it the second test result I felt great…but my numbers were high..I didnt stop, I say like reverse cancer..when you get cancer you first say I feel good , but you have markers and numbers. then go down hill fast
      Me I started to feel better , But I still had bad numbers…I stuck with it a year and they lowered and everything has lined up.( as 2.5 years have gone by , my microbiome -bacteria is building up more and more— and every same health problem I had thru life is gone…

      I have had a fun ride— the part that amazes me most is I didnt do anything the GI told me( because other family members did and there died–or I see slowly dieing adding a illness every year)… when your sick fiber is rough a no no., and the GI promotes more brats foods..I did the opposite
      **I ate more fiber-in the way of veggies , inulin ** My system went nuts at first–flushing–I did not like any of these foods!!!( i say removing yeast and bad bacteria due to Ph shitting and different bacteria being introduced.( most would say this is a flare—-but many experts say this is also the body removing what should not be there( one problem with may who flare, why are they flaring)…A lab person told me to add in a specific bacteria strain-to lower a bad strain found in me(it would eat it)..with in 2 days my system dumped( A normal person would take more meds to stop this) My lab person said to take less of the bacteria as my system was overwhelmed removing the other.. I did what she said.. and she appeared to be right

      but in the end It appears the vegetable fibers and inulin fixed my gut as well changing the bacteria (adding in good). The complete opposite of what the GI said to do..

      In the end I believe I have completely changed the microbiome in me…and I'm seeing that in stool testing… hence why I am different now
      GI's don't do this they just give the PURPLE PILL to remove ACID . and give drugs to turn off the immune systems reactions… There is no re balance of the microbiome or getting to the real causes. What all of my family got… a band aid for a fire hose leak

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie,

      Again, it’s wonderful that you’re feeling better with what you’ve done. But, I think you are confusing people when you say “yeast is gone but my ph is higher 7″ and “the yeast keeping the ph low”.

      The medical literature — in the context of the human gut — does not support those statements when it comes to fighting yeast.

      My guess is that either your tests are unreliable or you are conflating your results with incorrect conclusions. In the human gut, yeast does not “keep the pH low”. In fact, it does quite the opposite.

      I already showed you more than half a dozen studies that explain why alkalinity promotes candida overgrowth. Perhaps you didn’t take the time to read the literature. At any rate, it’s very clearly explained in layman’s terms here:

      Why does Candida overgrowth require an alkaline environment?

      Candida overgrowth relies on increased alkalinity in your intestines. It needs neutral or alkaline conditions to switch to its fungal form. This is why acid-producing probiotics like acidophilus are so effective at slowing and even reversing the overgrowth, and why caprylic acid is an effective antifungal. Your digestive system has evolved with a naturally acidic environment that protects us against pathogens like Candida, so when you begin your Candida treatment plan you need to maintain that acidity.

      Candida not only prefer an alkaline (or less acidic) environment; it actually acts to further reduce the acidity of your intestines. One of Candida’s byproducts is ammonia, an alkaline gas that forms when the Candida Albicans yeast ferments sugar in your intestine. Ammonia increases the alkalinity of your digestive tract, and has even been found to promote the growth of other yeasts. A 2011 study (see here) found that “under acidic conditions, this species can raise the pH from 4 to greater than 7 in less than 12 hours”. The same study showed that by alkalizing its environment, Candida triggers a switch to its pathogenic, hyphal form, which is the form that causes Leaky Gut Syndrome.

      The acidic environment in your stomach and intestines is hugely important – its your first line of defense against pathogens that enter your digestive system. A 2001 study found that “both capric and lauric acids are active in killing Candida Albicans and may therefore be useful for treatment of infections caused by that pathogen”. Additionally, one of the most popular and effective antifungals for Candida overgrowth is actually caprylic acid. Studies have shown that coconut oil, which contains caprylic acid and lauric acid, is another effective antifungal.

      This leads us on to another very important part of your Candida treatment: probiotics. One of the reasons that probiotics are so effective in treating Candida is that they produce small amounts of lactic and acetic acid. This helps to rebalance the pH in your intestine and restore the acidity that is needed to curb the Candida overgrowth. In fact one of the most common reasons that a Candida overgrowth happens is that a course of antibiotics has killed the acid-producing bacteria in your stomach, thus making the environment too alkaline and allowing the Candida to thrive.

      Does that make sense?

      Again, the main reason why caprylic acid has been shown to work in a petri dish is because it’s an acid. That’s pretty much it. There’s nothing particularly special about it and it’s actually a very weak anti-fungal once you swallow it since it’s fairly diluted and quickly metabolized into energy. In fact, virtually any acid should have the same effect (Apple Cider Vinegar, for instance).

      Again, I think it’s wonderful that you’ve managed to make yourself feel better, but your conclusions do not match up with the medical literature. Your GIT should be slightly acidic. That is well known.

      It sounds like your Ulcerative Colitis perhaps contributed to an extremely acidic environment (as explained in my previous comment) and you found ways to ameliorate those UC flareups and thus avoided the extremely low pH. But the fact that no yeasts are showing up in your tests does not actually prove anything and you certainly shouldn’t be encouraging others to make their guts neutral or alkaline. You could really hurt people with that kind of advice!

      Hope that makes sense.

    • Duck,

      This is my whole point , as I test my many tests OAT test scores lowered and I have less and less fungal markers
      example Arabinose , as well my AMCA in my IBD expanded panel went down, as well now no microscopic yeast detected.. and other tests

      I also have lost all my allergies, I understand that publicans state the opposite why Im try to state my case… your focused on pasting them in….I understand that but thats not happening to me

      I AM SEEING THINGS DIFFERENT IN ME THAN WHAT IS BEING SAID ……………so as my PH went up my yeast went down.

      I also point to the fact that my
      Bifidobacterium and Bacteroides are different then eveyone else along with my akkermansia
      and I seem to be close to what there seeing in this study
      Look at this study http://aem.asm.org/content/early/2013/09/23/AEM.02545-13.full.pdf
      Many studies point to Bacteroides as bad but also at times antimicrobial depending on what there mixed with

      Duck I m stating my gut went up from 5 to 7

      In my past posts I didnt tell anyone to make there gut a 7 I think DR GRACE can back me up here.. I said most should most likely be in the low 6′s I said for my case , I have seen yeasts go down as MINE went up 5 to 7

      But I also have gained alot of good bacteria…

      I Understand my experience doesnt match up with medical literature why I,m pointing out my story!!!!!!!
      You also realize they dont know how to cure IBS and crohns / colits and they dont look at yeasts and how they work with bacteria

    • I also said DR GRACE can answer the advice on PH not me , and she did in a past post.. I said mine may not be right,,, be she could answer that
      better, I said my guess would be a low 6 would be good..
      I am not seeing the ROARING back of yeast that all the medical literature states as well..My toe nails are great now, no athletes foot, no migraines, great skin , no mucus. no sinus problems , or runny nose

      This is just me ……what I have observed in documenting my life for 2.5 years

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Ok.. I see, Eddie. Well, I’m glad we clarified. It’s just really hard to follow your unique writing style!

      Doing the best I can.

    • Eddie,
      Duck,

      isn’t part of the confusion the fact mentioned by Eddie sometime before?

      - that if you do have the bad, fungal form of Candida already, the aim AT THAT PHASE must be to calm it down, by diet and pH modulation or medication, so that it switches into the beneficial yeast form?

      - when that happens, only then you can try to flush the excess out, by diet and pH modulation.

      Eddie, can you comment?

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Not sure I understand your question, Gemma. Typically the goal is to make your gut normal (i.e. mildly acidic). Same thing with a vagina. Nobody wants a neutral or alkaline vagina (am I right, fellas?). The acid keeps candida in its non-pathogenic yeast form. It’s like a light switch. Alkaline/neutral environments just turn on the hyphal growth gene. You turn it off by making the environment slightly acidic. This appears to apply to a number of pathogens as well, as we evolved with mildly acidic GITs.

      Eddie’s test went from an extremely acidic to neutral and he felt better — something apparently seen with UC patients.

      Eddie thinks it’s related to yeast (since yeast disappeared in his test results). But, I’m not so sure. Yeast/candida is extremely difficult to test for. And I would think just because it shows up on a test doesn’t necessarily mean it’s hyphal — his could have been benign when his pH was 5 for all we know. Many doctors won’t even perform the yeast tests because the results are so unreliable and inconclusive.

      Dr. Fungus said:

      “There is no laboratory test that allows a clear identification of patients affected with this presumed disorder. Actually, “no clear definition of the disease has ever been advanced” [220]. Considering these facts, it is impossible to set criteria to establish and identify patients affected with this supposed disease.” [LINK]

      My guess is that eddie is confusing issues. He likely improved his other conditions (ulcerative colitis, etc), his pH shot to 7 (SAD-like?) and the yeast stopped showing up on the tests, leading him to conclusions that don’t match up with the medical literature.

    • Gemma,

      Like with all stomach diseases theirs no true answer , we can site and point to hundreds of links, but no one has a clue( were searching in science for a magic pill -(THAT will never come)—no ones really been cured (IBS etc). So no one really knows.. why we are all hear going back and forth :) And people are looking at RS as a source to fix them self—and it seems to work for the 90 % along with probiotics , inulin and fibers. We all know that
      Im focused on the the 10 percent- as you see when you get here, Im sure 90 percent of us havent there is NO HELP. Doc point to some of the same stuff , Duck has– I questioned all this and some how it works..Some how I got to where I am today– no disease and no immune drugs( I guess I an a freak and except that) I also dont seem to be sliding down the slide like the rest of my family now. Im going up the ladder ( and no one knows why) My doc wants me to go to hopkins so they can pull my genes – there pulling genes out of people with crohns to compare which are alike.

      Duck is correct!!!!! and is stating many facts that standard medicine follows– but standard medicine also does not believe in fungus/yeast as a problem unless your immune compromised — Many of us get so many antibiotics thru life– I believe more of us are and dont know it and I doc dont as well.- why you see the up tick in allergies, gut diseases etc and the big one Diabetes. You will see many doctors in Russia give anti fungals along With antibiotics – they seem to get it over there a little more–Our US doctors no so much

      There are many ideas on how to get rid of yeast/ lower it—in the end you need some, its not like its all going to go away.( you have to lower and push it out and change it back to its (non dr jekyll form) You have some people that say starve it (eat low carb no sugar) take herbs etc to kill lower it..eat fats. This will help but in the long term the yeast switch to fats–
      Something DUCK has pointed out in ketones.. Duck is very knowledgeable !!!!!
      Then you have others that say this doesnt work at all because when the yeast come back and learn to eat fats you have a bigger problem.
      There are many plans and yes DUCK points out in theory yeast like Alkaline/neutral environments. He seems to have many links ready. This is correct…..and how wants an ACID female area…. Duck has all the facts pointing to what standard medicine says. But you will see just about every one doesnt get over this. It is also said fungus will move to deep in the bone.. I myself may have this..All my tests are perfect now, the last part im working on is osteoporosis- back osteopenia left hip ( side where fistula was) and left neck.
      So far my bone metabolites -phosporic numbers have increased by 700.. as well when I started anti fungals I got muscle pain in all three areas(my doc was lost)

      A more balanced approach in the end keeps it at bay. But many of the factors above have helped many– you just cant stay that way LOW carb etc for ever( just like drugs the effects stop working) We see evidence it also KILLS good microbes , that is a fact

      For me I like doug kauffmanns approach = I think he seems to be the guy that has the right idea( hes written many books and cites many medical studies, reports etc )…I didnt follow his two diets , but in the end I look back and ate that way.

      doug—> http://www.knowthecause.com/

      the diet–http://www.robinallan.com/uploads/1/6/2/7/1627227/antifungaldiet.pdf

      his diet is to starve fungus(phase 1)–at first use some herbs /supplements then SWITCH to eat a more balanced diet in his phase 2 –once you have brought back things to normal you can eat the potatos , rice , starches — but he suggests others grains ,and no corn and peanuts as these are loaded with mycotoxins / fungus .He feels once the yeast have been brought down then under control—- your bacteria will balance out and you will feed them with good sources of veggies, fibers, inulin etc Some RS

      For me I had issues all my life , jock itch any time playing sports, skateboard, I always got athletes food. I had sinus problems, nasal congestion, clogged ear with wax- doc used a water gun to remove as a kid. bad Hemorrhoids starting at 5 years old. I can name more etc examples..

      Again here , no doctor tests for fungus like DUCK says — there is no one reliable test..
      I point back to ASCA(bakers brewers yeast)– same– many with disease will have high ASCA –DR GRACE will tell you this ask her. For me I was AMCA different yeast/molds
      Science has not figured this out yet– but many have this high ASCA but its unreliable alone

      Many doctors do not know much on fungus– why people seek out naturopath docs… there idea is a little different. A small few doctors are now realizing the issue and will use multiple tests to base a investigational diagnoses– as again the medical community doesn’t believe in fungus NORMALLY- and these docs dont know what to do.

      Im not saying DR Mc Combs is the go to guy.and I dont want duck to say hes a chiropractor– but this link shows some tests (just an example)that can be used in conjunction http://www.candidaplan.com/new/faq_2/faq.php?t=sq&uin=11

      For me I have done many tests in 2.5 years.. using many together I have seen alot ofstrange things/readings ( not one test– but several retesting) I may be killing my self time will tell

      Crohns is well documented in my family many cases – Looking back I now know I had this for a while, I have come to the understanding my crohns was caused by fungus/ yeast.. I also know that many of the people that did not get crohns got type 2 —which many point to fungus as the cause. Since I worked on cleaning up fungus– killing lowering(herb, supplements) eating fats ,I seemed to get better, I switched to more fiber, and inulin eating less fats.. but do eat fats , my bacteria came back and I am now adding in more types
      and able to digest many things I couldnt.

      I can see in my testing my yeast levels go down (from various different tests not relying on one.
      At the same time, thou my bacteria that I have 3x more then any one else in akkermansia shot up..Im going to site 3 links as Duck likes links NO disrespect , just thought you might want to check them out
      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/05/130515113744.htm

      http://syontix.com/akkermansia-muciniphila-prebiotics-and-obesity/

      http://www.nature.com/news/gut-microbe-may-fight-obesity-and-diabetes-1.12975

      I showed what my other bacteria was in other posts. Its nothing like anyone else… I know my whole life Ive had some crohns issues now, and have formed my opinion it was caused by fungus— I say this as everything is gone now and things havent come back. In my many investagive tests( yeast- they have come down) As for the ulcer colitis – I never had this until total failure at 38 and this has not come back as well.

      My idea , I m not stating any science facts just all ive done —is that some how the akkermansia is protecting my gut READ THE LINKS… as well my strange bacteroides bifidobacterium(seem to work in hand) . Its as almost the yeast cant do anything there in CHECK…. which I say has a strong relation with the akkermansia doing this–almost like the PH doesnt matter for them now
      Im sure If I get to high other problems will start-why Im monitoring my self regularly in testing..

      bacteroides bifidobacterium( seem to be working for me)
      this link shows how the two produce SCFA’s
      http://aem.asm.org/content/early/2013/09/23/AEM.02545-13.full.pdf

      And again —for the 10 percent if you cant now where with RS and or you fought yeast to no avail

    • And again —for the 10 percent if you cant get anywhere with RS and or you fought yeast to no avail

    • Gemma,

      As well I should point out that when yeast get pathogenic when they change forms the thought is the turn Root like digging in the mucus barrier.. Yeast is thought to live deep in the barrier. What I worked hard on(lowering them) ….then inulin, for me ,I now have no mucus–the Akkermansia
      is thought to be a MUCUS eater as well one thought to change barrier function by strengthening it . I had a large decrease in inflammation If you read all the links you ll see where im coming from.. It is also a pathogen hunter…

    • Guttural says:
    • Guttural,
      great links thanks– I eat a little with my eggs :)

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      @ Guttural. Sure. And the researchers determined that the “optimal dose” for Caprylic acid in the rats was determined to be 5 g/kg per day. That’s the equivalent of 350g (.77 pounds) of caprylic acid per day in an average adult.

      It’s just a weak way to combat candida when consumed orally. And most consumed caprylic acid is quickly metabolized for energy. It’s certainly good for you.

    • Guttural says:

      Optimal meaning 100% survival rate from 10mg/kg intravenous E. Coli.
      Yeah it isn’t a yeast killing machine but it’s good for your gut.

    • @Eddie

      Thanks for all the info here and mentioning the Ackermansia again, it may be important for some people to realise that the way to better health may not be easy.

      Have you considered the test for genes – in order to find out about FUT2 status?

    • Gemma & Duck

      I took a fast look last time , I think you and grace spoke of this. …Need to look in greater detail. Maybe tonight :) Wheres a good source that does these tests??? any idea on the cost any good links on this??? I dont think my standard lab does it(labcorp) Any thoughts duck on this one???

      You see Duck is amazing at pointing out alot of good stuff smart dude!!! He has hes facts lined up, sharp as a tack. Im just pointing out , I ve taken a different approach (not standard), for me( I got better-all docs are lost) I think Im on to something with the Ackermansia, ( almost like how tator / richard are with RS) as well Ackermansia mixed with other bacteria (maybe its blocking out – or hunting pathogens /or yeast something–even thou my Ph is a little higher.. From many studies I only posted 3 basic ones you see there is interest in Ackermansia– in they know it thickens the barrier, hunts and eats mucus..

      Duck points out , very detailed stuff , He is smart . I don’t want to get in a tit for tat as Im sure its confusing people more.( Im just saying if all else fails –really try my route) I think DucK and I could do better emailing and chatting swapping info / and comparing some stuff.
      Let me know on the FUT2 I was interested in the 23andme until they chopped off the medical part(genes)

      On another note—- I find this very interesting
      on the HADZA tribe you may have seen this

      The Hadza not only lack the ‘healthy bacteria,’ and they don’t suffer from the diseases we suffer from, but they also have high levels of bacteria that are associated with disease!!!!

      Of course they also eat different , have different skin microbes etc – but we are trying to load our self with what we think are good microbes ( that science says are good) Now I really confused people and my self :)
      heres a link http://www.wired.com/2014/04/hadza-hunter-gatherer-gut-microbiome/

      any thoughts on this –I thinks its pretty wild

    • @Eddie

      I think it was pointed out here by Dr. Grace that 123andme is still open, for ancestral purposes. So if I get it right, you get a full report, WITHOUT the medical explanations or possible health associations. But if you look around, you will find what the gene status means.

      On Hadza: yes it was here discussed too, don’t forget that a big part of their microbiome was not identified – in other words the science has no taxonomic names for the bugs that live in their guts. So these bacteria and many others that we consider as pathogenic can be helping them in digesting, and defying their own human genome (even among Hadza are people with “disadvantaged” FUT2 status, for instance).

      Remember that Dr. Ayers said: “Autoimmunity and allergies are not genetic destiny and they can be cured with diet and bacteria.”

    • Gemma,
      Yeah I saw that on there site and saw she pointed that out, seems alot of work…but maybe worth it about a month ago I found another place that does testing like 23andme but licensed with the fda to do it 3x more thou. Did you use the 23and me for the purpose of looking for FUT2 status???

      I myself also have a microbe that was not identified I have x43 times more then anyone seen in the Amgut. most enriched Family 0319-6G20 very interesting article thou on there guts Vs ours… you dont really see any Lacto bacteria I’d love to see what there stool PH is….dont ever see that listed

      I like your comment “””” Dr. Ayers said: “Autoimmunity and allergies are not genetic destiny and they can be cured with diet and bacteria”””” DEAD ON….with me all allergies seem gone(seasonal) and many food…

    • @Eddie

      Myself – no testing, I do not care at the moment. People with some sicknesses should consider it, I think.

      Other people used 123andme. We know how to read the data.

      It is a funny one you have: no data on it, really..
      http://wwww.patricbrc.org/portal/portal/patric/Taxon?cType=taxon&cId=117742

      See how complex it is? Listen to your body and feed it well :-)

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie,

      It’s a little tough to generalize what these bacteria do from person to person. And just one of the reasons why is because these microbes behave differently in different environments.

      For instance, we know (from above) that Candida is dimorphic — it can be pathogenic or benign in different pH environments.

      But, E. Coli is the same way. In an acid environment, it plays a role in the production of vitamin K for the body. In an alkaline environment it becomes the pathogenic.

      If we extrapolate that to the Hadza, we can imagine that it’s entirely possible that they have mildly acidic guts from the huge amount of fiber they consume (largely from baobab), and their acidic environment may in fact render these “pathogens” benign or even beneficial.

      So, when discussing these bacteria, I think we may need to consider the context in which those bacteria are living before making generalizations.

      Speaking of which, Eddie, I’ve been wondering how someone like you eats tons of Inulin, ferments SCFAs, and doesn’t have a mildly acidic gut. Something doesn’t seem right about that! Doesn’t that seem odd to you?

    • Duck,

      yeah thats why I pointed out the link here
      bacteroides bifidobacterium( seem to be working for me some how?????)
      this link shows how the two produce SCFA’s
      http://aem.asm.org/content/early/2013/09/23/AEM.02545-13.full.pdf KIND OF LIKE ME

      When I scan thru It ——-its long they talk about ” Succinic ” in one part Ive seem this go up at times — can be BAD!!!! but then at times good

    • Duck,

      I think Im going to test my POO for you for a straight week morning and night(paper ph) to see what my PH is for you—- you seemed so focused I ll start this weekend…Im sure the PH moves up and down

      Ill chart it all week and write down the FOODS I eat each day , plus my probiotic pill, vitamins , krill oil

    • @Eddie

      Now I start thinking that you are FUT2 non-secretor and the newly formed exopolysaccharides, thanks to B. bifidum and B. thetaiotaomicron, fixed your mucosa, which is nicely fucosylated now :-)

      You have mentioned 10%, the number in population is rather 20%.

      The pH which Duck keeps on pointing to is a mystery still. For how long have you been feeling god, compared to being sick before?

    • @Eddie

      Of course other Bacteroides needed too.

    • I have felt good for 2.5 years now

      zero issues— my only issue is if I add in flax and to much will loosen stool…or give me nose bleeds rarely use it( something I noticed)

      Im sure I dont stay LOCKED at 7 Ph… my last test showed 7 a year before that when I was sick I was a 5 Ph…

      Just for the fun of It I have some PH paper from 2.5 years ago–I started looking at my urine because when I was sick– my urine was very acid like.. Ill use the PH paper and check my stool BE A GOOD TEST????? hell im up for it…..i probably should have already done that never thought about it..

      Ill track my food –etc vit (i use 50 mcg of b complex, 1000 mg krill and 4000 IU of vitd3 (soy free source) and RENEW life 50 billion probiotic –the b complex I use every 3 days some time every other day

      Any better way to look at stool PH….Im up for the study

    • Maybe my strange make UP????

      Most abundant microbes
      Genus Bacteroides 37.3%
      Genus Parabacteroides 20.1%
      Genus Akkermansia 13.2%

      YOU have to say the studies on Akkermansia are interesting ????

      DUCK and Gemma

    • @Eddie

      Mercy! I try my best to understand you. What was your question, if any?

      I understand vit B (B3 in B complex surely) helps you to keep Candida and bad bugs at bay.

      Food sources of B3 listed below. Which of those are you not eating? :-)))))

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niacin#Food_sources

    • Gemma,

      Now you have me lost —- I answered below in another post–
      but Ill answer the food question on B3 i eat at the end is from the other post

      liver, heart and kidney
      chicken, chicken breast
      beef
      fish: tuna, salmon, halibut
      eggs
      avocados
      tomatoes (rare)
      leaf vegetables
      broccoli
      carrots ( FEW)
      asparagus
      NUTS— pumpkin , almond, walnut hazel

      I have felt good for 2.5 years now

      zero issues— my only issue is if I add in flax and to much will loosen stool…or give me nose bleeds rarely use it( something I noticed)

      Im sure I dont stay LOCKED at 7 Ph… my last test showed 7 a year before when I was sick I was a 5 Ph…

      Just for the fun of It I have some PH paper from 2.5 years ago–I started looking at my urine because when I was sick– my urine was very acid like.. Ill use the PH paper and check my stool BE A GOOD TEST????? hell im up for it…..i probably should have already done that never thought about it..

      Ill track my food –etc vit (i use 50 mcg of b complex, 1000 mg krill and 4000 IU of vitd3 (soy free source) and RENEW life 50 billion probiotic –the b complex I use every 3 days some time every other day

      Any better way to look at stool PH….Im up for the study( tracking my PH to make others Happy)

    • Thanks Eddie,

      I could not possibly keep up with all your posts :-)

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie. My bad. Looks like the lab reports says a fecal pH below 6.1 is considered to be too acidic. That would explain your problems with a fecal pH of 5 (which would be waaay too low according to the labs). So, 5 was definitely problematic for fecal pH.

      And it seems the reason for that is that a lot of the SCFAs should be absorbed into the large intestine during transit, making normal feces more neutral (or only slightly acidic) by the time they reach the colon.

      So, if we look at the chart I referenced earlier, we see that when someone ferments a lot, the caecum can have a pH of 5.5, but by the time the poo gets to the colon, it’s pH could be 6.2. And that sounds pretty ideal.

      That individual should easily be able to keep candida at bay. But, a fecal pH of 5 would be problematic — indicating that their caecum would be even lower in pH, which is kind of scary and way too acidic.

      This seems to match up with the fecal pH of people in third world countries who seem to have fecal pHs between 6.1 and 6.3 and low incidence of colon cancer, while whites tend to be closer to 6.8.

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2001440/

      So.. Looks like fecal pH should be just under 7 and nowhere near 5 since it is not directly indicative of the pH of the caecum and proximal colon.

      Sounds like your poo is nearly fine, Eddie. Which means that your caecum and proximal colon are likely mildly acidic. Perhaps your colon could be a little more acidic (~6.2 to ~6.8), but looks like you’re not that far from average right now as it is.

      Sorry for the confusion!

    • @Eddie

      So why don’t you go to John Hopkins (via your doctor) and let them do all the testing (including genes), and tell them your story?

      There is a hope to solve IBD/UC with fecal transfers, which would make the “SEEDING”, but they miss the WEEDING and FEEDING by food.

      You know more that the doctors, I’m sure.

    • Gemma,

      Interesting articles … For me in stool testing I have lower Lactobacillus and action bacteria. the cyanobacteria is a little low compared to others .But as I test longer and longer the Lactobacillus gets lower and lower.. My proteobacteria seems in line with others. I have been working on UP ing the cynao bacteria right now.. as well adding a couple more strains of bifido. 5 strains bifido and 7 lacto strains.total. My iron comes in a little low some times in testing(iron store is fine) —which I suppose is due to missing cyanobacteria bacteria.. as I read ive found this deals with iron (processing it)… I have been playing adding in small amounts of spirulina(cyanobacteria) I feel great zero problems..

      I know I was missing many bacteria in the start of my experiment. By being sick at the start was the cause low bacteria making yeast go up??? – or was it the reverse the high yeast fungus cause the bacteria to go low…..i will never know.

      I can say as Ive worked on yeast/fungus — and up ing the akkermansia bacteria. this seems to be where to start. Some how I think these two are linked… Some how —what ever im doing this seemed to be the magic key. Now Im working on fixing all the other problems.

      Gemma the articles are very cool and I guess I need to gene test more here.. Ive read alot on nod card genes just not the fut ones.

      Some how I know the yeast thing is related to crohns.. As almost all have antibodies to ASCA or AMCA. (plus my own personal experience) I think its some off shoot of gluten issues due to yeasts/fungus. They seem to be treating the secondary problem to me from whats happen to me…(they did the same– giving antibiotics etc)to me the secondary problem is the bacteria– leaking in and infecting people –due to missing akkermansia(barrier) missing due to yeasts/fungus… in the end the antibiotic treatment they used didnt help.
      until I screwed with the fungus/yeast part.

      At one time I went to hopkins(fistula), I tried to explain what was happening and they seemed to not care.(this place was worse then my local hospital–it was like a factory -get in get out. I asked how I could get in touch with a researcher…they blew me off and said look on the web. (I found the 3 top guys they have—just havent contacted them) I have also searched the web looking for the top USA gluten guy) he was local to MD but now is in MA. I may contact him first. Im still somewhat convinced its more related to akkermansia.. and would love to see the gluten guy test this .
      I want several years 3 to go by before I do any thing so I can give them a stack of papers..of my medical history for 3 years showing whats happen to me and where I am today…

      On that note I PH tested this morning my stool it was 6.6

    • Duck,

      Yeah no problem man… you interest me – you are very interested in this field and go out of the way to research stuff, this is great. You are a great help on here.

      reading and seeing all this happen to me, it makes me wonder if you basically have different PH levels all along the path to exist. We are really only getting the PH on out poo at the exist. I wonder on the bacteria to.

      For example my probiotic is HIGH in lacto. I also eat alot of kimchi and kraut. But when I test I have none,. which makes me wonder if I have alot… but there staying up High never the stomach — and other bacteria are staying lower in the colon… almost like bacteria are now staying in certain areas like they should( when I was sick im sure everything was every where.

      I know im a strange bird— case.. I feel the yeast caused the issue by having low akkermansia . What are your thoughts on this akkermansia??? I stool tested this morning you have me wondering– used the PH strips kind of hard to tell but looks like I am between 6.6 and 6.8 this morning.
      my food yeasterday

      morning 2 eggs with coconut oil, red pepper, celery ,almond butter , walnuts, cucumber, saurerkraut. 2 cooked onions. Latte mad from almond milk (has guar gum )

      lunch – baked chicken, lemon garlic spinach, green beans , cauliflower and carrots

      dinner, grilled chicken, kraut, baked parsnips, green pepper, asparagus-with coconut oil . some paleo bread has Psyllium

      vit 50 mcg B complex, 1000 mg krill, 4000 iu vit d3

    • @Eddie

      Okay I understood wrongly before there was certain interest in your case from John Hopkins. Sad it is not the case. Perhaps if you contact the researchers via email you might get some feedback.

      I am glad Duck could finally clear the confusion on pH – read the gdx manual.

      Regarding Lactobacilli – what is your opinion? Are they just passing by and do not colonise because they either cannot / are not needed? Your general inflammation is low I guess. Do you eat any fermented veggies like sauerkraut?

      Regarding L-fucose: there are other little essential sugars, but this one is perhaps the most important one.

      If I may ask: what are the remaining problems?

      Good luck on your way :-)

    • Oh surely you do eat sauerkraut – I was reading too fast. Sorry for the repeated question, again.

    • Gemma,

      you know , im not sure on the Lactobacilli all the research say GOOD… my probiotic which I tip my hat off to RENEW LIFE 50 billion or 80 billion has many strains. I eat kimchi and tons of kraut. I eat the kraut 2 times a day –you read some say BAD for yeast others say good..Just like with everything no one knows… Most kraut is crap as they add vinegar(very bad for yeast). Real kraut should be cabbage /salt only.

      my inflammation is low now CRP is c reactive protein it is like .07 hangs here. when my gut was a mess it was 15!!!!! BAD…. as well I cant remember off the top of my head one GI marker I posted (paper not with me) one GI inflammation marker I was a 1300 anything over 600 is BAD today im a 97

      The lacto bacteria..im comfused on…I eat alot( other then yogurt( my quack listed tests – elisa bio and enterolab tests showed bad markers here for dairy–I dont do butter or yogurt now) To me maybe I dont do so well with this bacteria in the lower colon?? or it stays high( or the fact Im fine with it just not from a dairy source(as the dairy proteins look like yeast)….(the tests elisa act bio and enterolab duck points out are questionable— for me, i think ive used to my advantage for yeast / and leaking gut.

      Ive read lacto can be found in different parts(of GI tract Lacto ). To me , Im guessing I have alot.. but its staying HIGH in the tract so , in stool testing it doesnt take the roller coaster ride down the tract to lower colon. Just my guess maybe DUCK knows more.. On one of the FREE THE ANIMAL pages Richard has a picture and shows the bacteria in different parts of the tract- I know theres a 20 foot section GI’s dont go in the endo only goes so far down and the colonoscopy only goes so far up…. this leaves a 20 foot section docs dont go in…there is a test a balloon (something) but almost never used(rare) the ballon is used to straighten out the section to look at them. This area I think seems the most un explored and where the problems seem to be. ( seems from charts this is where ACTIONOBACTERIA would be and yeasts….if your missing action bacteria -the problem would start here.. going up or down GI —this is just a guess… ( many of the action bacteria are in your soil based probiotic– Prescript assist –Maybe why some DO so well with RS as there Yeast problem is not extreme. (your getting more of these bacteria BLOCKING the yeast effect—Just a guess chime in DUCK– ME I have almost NONE— why Im working up to the soil based probiotic

    • Gemma,

      my long response I didnt answer the remaining problems…. I really dont have any problems now…2 thou ( I suspect low PH gave me osteoporosis)

      My family history is long with heart disease, irregular heart beat, arthritis, gut problems , thyroid and osteoporosis, sinus problems and migraines, snoring need cpap machine
      all mothers side( Italian)

      For me , Some of this stuff starting creeping up.. As my gut started to fail, i would be sitting watching Tv and my chest felt like it was fluttering…some say this can be from acid. I started to snore loud and choke in my sleep.. my sinus clogged more

      At 38 I asked for an osteoporosis bone density test my doc laughed at me–said your to young. I did it and I had some in hip , left neck and back. He was shocked.. doing the anti fungals I got pain in those areas… which was strange. (muscle pain) doc was really lost

      right now my only problems … are at times iron coming in a little low ( and reversing the osteoporosis) my bone markers are now rising.. I will retest bone density in dec. I figure it will take several years to change this.

      my blood pressure is now checked on fri 97/63 standing 73 no sinus , no migraines, no seasonal allergies , no snoring , sleep good, no heart flutter…no GI inflammtion or CRP inflammation Sed rate is low too

      For me I think bacteria and yeast are related to heart disease, and my families gut s made this happen due to yeast and bacteria leaking in.. just my guess

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      eddie said:

      …it makes me wonder if you basically have different PH levels all along the path to exist. We are really only getting the PH on out poo at the exist. I wonder on the bacteria to

      Ding ding ding. Yes, that’s what I was saying. Look at the chart!

      Subjects swallowed “radiotelemetry capsules” that communicate the pH throughout the journey through the GIT. See how the pH is lower in the caecum and proximal colon? That’s what I’m saying. pH rises as it gets to the colon since the SCFAs are absorbed along the way. Your poo should be somewhere between 6.1-6.8 ideally (as yours is).

      Here’s another study that shows the same thing.

      So, your poo is very normal at 6.6-6.8. And that’s indicative of a caecum and proximal colon that would be under 6.

      And when you say, “I wonder about bacteria too” I have to agree 100%.

      Personally, I have no interest in obsessing about the bacteria in my poo. I’m just not that impressed by the tests. Nevermind the inconsistencies between the various testing services or the inconsistencies between actual bowel movements. The part that I’m largely unimpressed by is that the bacteria in one’s feces is very different from the bacteria that is actually in the mucosa.

      Studies from the Stanford Relman Labs have shown that the bacteria in the poo is different from the mucosa.

      From: Diversity of the Human Intestinal Microbial Flora

      “We examined 13,355 prokaryotic ribosomal RNA gene sequences from multiple colonic mucosal sites and feces of healthy subjects to improve our understanding of gut microbial diversity. A majority of the bacterial sequences corresponded to uncultivated species and novel microorganisms. We discovered significant intersubject variability and differences between stool and mucosa community composition.”

      So, that study showed that there is considerable difference between mucosal and fecal populations. The differences were also summarized in this article regarding the work by the Stanford Relman Lab:

      From: Complex Gut Microflora-Host Relationships Are Important for Health

      David Relman of Stanford University in Stanford, Calif., and his collaborators are using genomics to look at commensal species diversity along the mammalian GI tract and, indeed, have worked with several human volunteers to probe diversity at particular sites along the GI mucosal layer and in feces. With some 11,000 microbial genomic sequences in hand, at least 7 phyla are represented with substantial diversity within each, although most of the sequences come from three main types of bacteria, he says. In addition, other types of microbes are found in minority representation, including sequence evidence for cyanobacteria species. Big differences in microbial populations are seen between specimens obtained from different individuals, and there is very distinct clustering per individual host, he adds. “We also see big differences between species found in mucosa versus in feces, but the [microbes found at] different sites along the mucosa are not that different.”

      So, one has to wonder… What’s the point of obsessing over the flora in our poo? The flora in our feces is the bacteria that’s leaving our digestive tract. It’s very different from the flora that’s actually staying in our digestive tract.

      The main reason people test their poo is because someone can easily sell and analyze a test for it. I imagine if we could actually test the bacteria in our GITs, we probably wouldn’t care very much about poo testing. One day, in the future, we’ll probably look back and laugh at poo testing as being a rather primitive form of testing flora.

      To think that any of us can really come to any conclusions about one or two species that just happen to show up in our poo is pretty unrealistic in my opinion. My guess is that it’s way more complex than any of us can possibly imagine.

    • @Eddie

      All your results are very impressive.

      On bone repair: ever consider birch essential oil (externally)?
      See for instance here:
      http://heritageessentialoils.com/birch.php

      Birch is the same tree that Chaga grows on…

      Any if any hair or scalp problems, birch is the herb to use :-)

    • Gemma ,

      Im up for try odd things….as you can see :) I havent done anything that has been standard…

      What do you know about it…..have you used this

    • @Eddie

      If you like to chat ask Richard to connect he will give you my contact.

    • “My guess is that it’s way more complex than any of us can possibly imagine.” <— This! :)

      Trying to micromanage the gut biome, a few microbial strains or isolated prebiotics at a time, seems less and less realistic the more research uncovers about it, yes?

    • Duck yeah,

      Its way to complex….. its genes and bacteria/yeast.. we are all so different
      for me I realize, the amount of gluten genes, determines my health…antibiotics from yeast–turn the switch on for me…activating my antibodies(to yeast).. confusing my immune system with milk, soy gluten as yeast.. Things are normal.. my body can tell the difference in all them…when its not, my immune system ups and things everything is yeast…milk etc( pass on antibiotics for now) Like I say all the tests helped me..pin point it all… but in the end all of them are showing how bad my gut was leaking. ……( like you say).
      kind of like what you said we get different allergies thru life—im sure as our guts open up.

      Maybe Ive found something on the akkermansia bacteria there appears to be lot of positive with it and gut barrier….my gluten issue is gone…. but your right , im sure you really cant tell from POO exiting your butt your total GI heath…as the PH is different throughout

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Eddie,

      You certainly did highlight the akkermansia paradox — somehow strengthening the gut barrier while feasting on it. Nice work.

      But, again, the more important point is that the mucosa populations themselves are not accurately represented in the fecal populations.

      Just because your poo has 13% akkermansia doesn’t mean your mucosal layer is 13% akkermansia. It just means that 13% of the bacteria that decide to exit your GIT are akkermansia.

      Think of it this way. It would be like trying to accurately determine the ethnicity of passengers who ride a commuter bus line by only looking at the passengers who get off at the last stop.

      So, you can’t really make any meaningful conclusions from your poo. The poo tests are really only meant as a poor estimation of what’s going on in the GIT.

      And even if you did know your mucosal populations, you still wouldn’t be able to draw any meaningful conclusions from one or two species out of the thousand or so that reside there — particularly since many species react differently in different gut environments.

    • Duck
      you make a great point—-there no way to tell,!!!!!! For me it seems its doing something since its a mucus eater , barrier thickener..

      I lost all gluten issues and no more mucus…but this is only a guess because we can not accurately determine this its just a hypothesis

      of what happen to me…. whos to say I maybe Im making more Akkermansia and there being flushed out and not sticking… due to something I eat…. my idea could then be all wrong …your right no way to really know.. I may just be sheeeting out all my Akkermansia

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      Exactly. All I’m saying is you can’t easily connect Akkermansia to gluten or yeast or anything for that matter. For all you know, you have bloomed some other species that are metabolizing gluten and some other species that are producing more anti-candida fatty acids. Akkermansia is probably just a piece of the puzzle. Probably not worth focussing on one species so intently considering all we’ve discussed.

    • Duck

      YEAH MAN!!!! think its just a piece of the Unknown puzzle along with the RS

      Why i had pasted the terrible long link for you on the bacteroides..im sure multi factors mixed together are happening as you say…

      strange how Ive gotten better on low RS, but I know I need it to build back some missing action bacteria…if I want to stay good..( maybe my eating of several nuts and onions gave me some RS )

    • Duck Dodgers says:

      strange how Ive gotten better on low RS

      Well, I don’t think it’s that strange. You’ve gotten your gut to a proper pH by simply eating other fibers. Not all that shocking when you think about it. RS is just one of many fibers and is great for butyrate. It’s also really cheap, which is nice. :)

  13. Will any starch containing food create RS3 when cooked/cooled?

    I have been consuming a lot of RS2 (raw plantains) and with that I have tried adding fructans and starch. However, when I eat starch (from a sweet potato or cooked plantain) or fructans, I get joint problems (I have Ankylosing Spondylitis), itchy scalp, skin problems, and generally feel like shit. Do you know how I could get RS3 with minimal digestible starch?

  14. Any thoughts on activated charcoal?

  15. Will any starchy food make RS when cooked/cooled? Are there any sources that would have more RS3 and less starch?

    • tatertot says:

      Tough to answer. With real foods, cooked then cooled once, some create a good bit of RS3, some almost none. Short-grain rice and regular corn meal create almost zero RS3, long-grain rice and potatoes can be approx 2-5% RS. Some extracted starches seem to create really high levels of RS3, mung bean starch, sago starch, and maybe tapioca I believe, but there is really no way to capitalize on that. I make mung bean hummus, but that’s a bit different than mung bean starch.

      Reading your comment a couple up, it looks like you are wanting RS3 w/o the digestible portion if starch. That’s probably not possible. RS3 always comes with a price–digestible starch.

      If you absolutely must be on a low carb diet, maybe look into get fermentable fiber from inulin rich foods (dandelion greens, sunchokes, onions, garlic) and also supplement with larch AG or inulin.

      The inulin rich foods are low in starch, but there’s not a very big selection of them.

    • Thanks a lot for the in-depth response. I have trouble with fructans / inulin as well – anytime I eat onions / broccoli / beets / garlic I get essentially the same symptoms as if I eat starch.

    • Also I don’t want to be low carb – I just get symptoms when I eat starch and I don’t want to eat a ridiculous amount of fruit sugar. I don’t know how to raise it :(

  16. Ripken Holt says:

    I would suggest updating your Resistant Starch Primer for Newbies with all of this new info if you have not already.

  17. bettyboo says:

    Please release your book soon. My loins ache for a good long hard reading.

  18. cobalt says:

    I’m super new to all this, and really excited about the implications.
    I think I’m one of the ones that need it the most. I started taking PS a little more than a week ago and I’m pretty grumpy now. No real bloating, gas etc, just general irritation.
    How do I go about weeding? Do I stop taking the PS whilst I’m doing it? Is there one weed killer that is better than another?? Love some advice.

    • cobalt says:

      By the way I have read Dr Grace’s post on this. I just don’t find it all that clear.

    • tatertot says:

      You are asking a question that can’t be easily answered without knowing a ton of background. If you have a severely dysbiotic gut, your first stop should be a doctor and get some tests to see what you are up against.

      If you just have the SAD Pepto-Bismol generation gut, you should clean up your diet, add fermented foods, probiotics, good fiber/RS, exercise, and all that jazz.

      Eddie here is a good person to emulate if you are waaaay deep into it and doctors get you nowhere, otherwise lots of success stories turning around poor digestion and other gut-related issues with probiotics and prebiotics.

    • “By the way I have read Dr Grace’s post on this. I just don’t find it all that clear.”

      Welcome into the club.

    • cobalt says:

      Thank you so much Tatertot and Gemma.

      Ok, my diet is fairly good and I’ve spent years trying to clear out my system – liver cleanses, anti-candida herbs/remedies, metal detoxes… the list goes on and on and on ( I’ve had/still have chronic fatigue).
      So I’m just going to assume it is my system still slowly getting used to it. It is terribly over reactive, so I’ll just go slow.
      I kept reading and re-reading the link and thinking, ‘huh…? this is kind of the kitchen sink and a bit random’. So great to straight up know that there simply isn’t an easy answer. Makes things much much easier.
      Thanks again.

    • Cobalt,
      If your in such a mess….I was there , you need tests many your doc will not know or understand
      “its sad”

      You need to get a base with what you need to work on.. If your gut is a mess you need your GP or GI to do the IBD EXPANDED PANEL lab corp 162045.. as well investigate gluten testing etc … something you get daily you can react to 3 days later…so youll never know..
      Tests like the ELISA ACT BIO –BLOOD will help at removing foods the your immune system is over responding to…. same with enterolab fecal .. from there –all you have done is removed the foods that are over working you immune system… your goal is to close up the gut—- glutamine / inulin etc — weed , seed , soil based or non to start…. feed with fibers and fat and jump to the RS .. we are all different you may have a ton of bad bacteria ,,,, or all yeast , or NO yeast …. NO good bacteria from years of antibiotics and high bad strains..

      I will tell you this…if you dont get it under control… it will catchup to your later( happen to me)… some bowel problem or even some bad disease.

      If your gut is a mess , food proteins are leaking in, bacteria and or yeast… giving you intolerance , many as I say look like yeast ( milk , soy and gluten) years of antibiotics and some times you have no choice , kill your protective layer …some foods remove your gut lining

    • lol!! I’m lucky to have good translators! Or guest bloggers, that reminds me…

    • cobalt says:

      Thank you Eddie.
      I’m in Australia, so I hope there is something similar over here – I’m sure there is.
      I’ve have been healing myself for many years from chronic fatigue, so I don’t think my gut is still a super mess – it totally was! but not so bad anymore. I will continue to ramp up slowly, add the probiotics and watch it. Plus get the panel work done. Who knows what is in there!

    • cobalt says:

      Sorry Grace, I didn’t mean to sound rude, I really just wanted to get to the bottom of what weeding meant. That weeding means different things to different people is also very helpful. So the discussion here has been most useful.

    • Cobalt,
      You Not sure on the GDX….but greatplans lab will do international ..you could get the test… COMPSTOOL and OAT test

    • cobalt says:

      Thanks so much Eddie. Will look into it properly later in the day.
      Thanks again for such valuable information. xx

    • MY docs made me worse!!!! a GI’s answer is more probiotics and immune system drugs— turning of your immune system and killing more of your good bacteria

      A NO NO

    • cobalt says:

      Yes, they are pretty useless! I’ve been doctoring myself, you have to when you have chronic fatigue because doctors simply don’t know how to treat it.
      Oh well, I know lots and lots about health now! Have also consumed a million and one different supplements over the years, something I really don’t want to do anymore, so the prebiotic starch really appeals.

    • Cobalt,
      Vitamins are good…your best source is real FOOD…
      But , depending where your problem is … many of the very vitamins you consume actually can make you sick( you dont realize this) the doc said I need b vitamins(but what in the one you bought???)— if you have antibodies to milk and your vitamins contain it…you get the vitamin but you make your self sick

      Same with grains , gluten or say soy….I found this out in testing and actually looking closer into the vitamins( your allergy office wil not find all of your allergies –why ELISA ACT bio is important)

      Every one is pretty much low in vit d3… if you work at a desk thats 80 percent of us..were never in the sun.( maybe sat or sunday) Good docs will promote you up your vit d3 this is good for the immune system. When I was sick it was in the 20′s today I am in the 50′s. But 90 percent of vitd3 you buy in the store is SOY based.????? for me I wasnt getting better due to the vitamins actually still kicking up my antibodies. So I found a Lanolin olive oil based vit D3… It has done wonders. B complex free of soy,grains, starch ,and milk…

      why I point to testing.. if your gut isnt working your not taking in the vitamins… so you take all the pills and vitamins because you need them… but many of the pills have things in them your immune system is responding to.

      sticking you in a circle here as well….. another tip I learn in my investigative learning

  19. BigRob says:

    You guys wanna great Black Eyed Peas recipe?

    Google “Ghana Red Red” and prepared to fix and eat some deliciousness. Very very nutritious too.

    • tatertot says:

      Holy beans, BigRob – Those look amazing. A total RS/Fiber fest!

      Red-Red

      Red-Red, a popular dish in Ghana made from cowpeas (black-eyed peas), might be named for the combination of red pepper and red palm oil. The Red-Red cowpeas stew is usually served with Fried Plantains.
      plantains in cameroon

      What you need

      two to three cups dried cowpeas (black-eyed peas) or similar
      one cup red palm oil (or vegetable oil)
      one or two onions, thinly sliced
      two or three ripe tomatoes, quartered
      one or two bouillon cubes or Maggi® cubes (optional) — or — small piece of smoked or dried fish and/or one spoonful shrimp powder
      cayenne pepper or red pepper
      salt and black pepper
      several ripe or near-ripe plantains (but not overly ripe)

      What you do

      Clean the black-eyed peas in water in a large pot. Soak them in water for at least an hour or overnight. After soaking them, rub them together between your hands to remove the skins. Rinse to wash away the skins and any other debris. Drain them in a colander. If using smoked or dried fish: remove bones and skin, rinse and soak in water, then dry. If using dried shrimp: grind the shrimp (or obtain already ground or powdered shrimp).
      Place the black-eyed peas iIn a large pot, fill with water to just cover the peas. Bring to a slow boil, reduce heat, cover, and simmer until the peas are tender, thirty minutes to an hour. When cooked, the peas should be moist, but not standing in water.
      While peas are cooking: Heat oil in a skillet. Fry the onions until slightly browned, then add tomatoes, and fish and dried shrimp (if desired). Mash and stir the mixture to form a sauce.
      Stir the onion-tomato mixture into the black-eyed peas. Add buillon or Maggi cubes (if not using fish or shrimp). SImmer for ten minutes. Add salt, black pepper, and cayenne or red pepper to taste.
      While peas and sauce is simmering: Prepare Fried Plantains.
      Serve peas and plantains side by side on a plate.

      Maybe you would like some Kelewele, instead of plain fried plantains.

  20. BigRob says:

    Oh and a question for some. Will you get RS3 from Green Bananas if you cook and then cool them? Tanks

    BigRob

    • tatertot says:

      Yes. And the banana flour has a lot of RS3 if you use in baking.

    • Richard S says:

      Tater–according to “Sources and intake of resistant starch in the Chinese diet” Asia Pac J Clin Nutr 2010;19 (2):274-282, green banana has 38% of starch as RS, but cooked banana brings it down to about 5% in Figure 1. Cooked banana having RS3 at 5% does not sound like a lot to me. Does the RS3 in banana flour behave differently than that in whole banana?

    • tatertot says:

      The math gets confusing very fast.

      It’s a bit different when you are looking at banana flour because there is no moisture involved, making the percentage ‘as is’ higher. From what I have seen, banana flour made from cooked bananas has about 25% RS3, and banana flour made from raw bananas has about 50% RS2.

      If you cook with either one, the finished product will have about 25% RS3.

    • Richard S says:

      So does that make commercially available plantain chips a decent source of RS3?

  21. Richard S says:

    A thought on how to maximize RS3 with potato. The big RS table tatertot published showed cooked and cooked potatoes have the highest amount of RS among cooked foods (19g/100g as eaten). The thing is, that is based on having twice the density of total starch (36g/100g) as eaten according to the original reference or 52% of total starch compared to the other methods of cooking (boiled, etc. 17-18g, 31% of total starch). (Raw potato starch has about 80% RS2.) I infer that the roasting method evaporates much of the water so that the cooked weight is half the raw and boiled weights. By taking shredded potatoes and laying them out on a cooking sheet for 20 minutes at 350, I can get to that moisture level. Cool it overnight and use as your like.

    • tatertot says:

      The surest way to maximize RS3 is to cook in a way that removes the most moisture, ie. roasted potatoes vs boiled. What you propose sounds like a good way to make high RS potatoes.

    • Would cooking and cooling multiple times increase RS3?

      Would blending a plantain and then cooking / cooling potentially increase RS3 content?

    • tatertot says:

      Yes, but quite a waste of time. The biggest increase is in the first cycle. Food manufacturers make RS3/RS4 using the heat/cool techinique you describe.

      Eating leftovers cold, reheating and cooling leftovers, and eating some raw starches (ie. greenish bananas, nuts, seeds) is best way to acheive this all long-term. Supplement with potato starch on days you fall well short in the fiber department.

    • I want to do your 7-step SIBO plan but I have trouble with digestible starch – skin, joint, and anxiety problems. Do I need to weed first? Do I need to get a comprehensive stool test first? If I could e-mail you or call you and ask you more that would help me so much (if not no worries!). Thanks for everything you do.

    • James:

      I think “weeding” can exist at different levels for different people. In my case, all I did was add the 3 SBOs and the changes have been dramatic.

      Just to test, I’ll sometimes just take a bolus dose of PS of 4, 5, 6, or even 8 TBS. In the beginning, even 2 or 3 would cause 12-24 hours of laughable fartage. Now, since the SBOs, I can barely get a toot out, even at 8 TBS, chased with soaked, cooked, and cooled beans.

      That kind of drama tells you something good has happened.

  22. Pierson says:

    Just a question regarding the integrity of resistant starch, according to these two articles: http://www.agriculturejournals.cz/publicFiles/50855.pdf , apjcn.nhri.org.tw/server/APJCN/22/3/372.pdf

    Resistant starch is damaged and changed by various cooking methods, specifically microwaving. Accordingly, does anyone know if damaged resistant starch has different metabolic effects than non-damaged rice? I’ve looked around, and am a touch lost

  23. tatertot says:

    I’ve never seen anything to remotely suggest that RS has different effects when damaged. There are quite a few studies, as you’ve found, concerning the damaging of the raw starch granules with different milling techniques, but I think this is only of interest to the processed food manufacturing people.

    As insurance, though, and just good practice, spread the wealth. Get your RS and other fibers from a wide variety of real foods.

  24. doogiehowsermd says:

    I wanna see the look on Ray C.’s face if your book hits the NYT or Amazon best sellers list dude. That would be priceless.

  25. Harriet says:

    When I started taking potato starch it seems that was what most of us were using. Is this article suggesting that we can supply the resistant starch purely from foods readily available from most supermarkets plus a little from specialty stores? Or are most people continuing with a base line amount of potato starch daily but adding back legumes and some grains into the paleo diet base?

  26. Tom Hanks says:

    Reposting this from MDA’s Definitive Guide to Starch article since I haven’t gotten a response there:

    Forgive me if this has been outlined somewhere, but I’ve looked to the best of my ability and come up with nothing. I suspect it’s there, but hiding. Waiting. Watching. The PDF also sent me into tears of confusion. I understand everything about everything except how these translate into carbs (aka, the carbs that are converted into glucose).

    RS Type 1: Beans, grains and seeds.
    So if I were to soak and then cook a cup of kidney beans, that 37 g of carbs wouldn’t “count” toward my carb count, correct? Or do you subtract the amount of RS it has (I’ll go with the 10g), and thus only 27 would be regular old carby carbs?

    RS Type 2: Raw Potatoes, bananas, plantains.
    So if I eat a banana, it wouldn’t go towards my carb count?

    (Type 2 RS becomes accessible upon heating.)
    Was this an error? Because that sounds like Type 3… and from what I’ve read elsewhere they’re supposed to be raw. Or do I have to eat warm bananas? Mmm… warm bananas.

    RS Type 3: Cooked and cooled potatoes, grains, and beans.
    Yes, I just keep asking the same question. But I must know, specifically, for each type!!! If I eat some cooked and cooled or cooked and cooled and gently re-heated rice, or potatoes, or grains — all no carbs?!? NO CARBY WARBIES?!?!?

    The reason I’m being such a problem child is because I’ve seen both said: that they don’t go toward your carb count, but also that they do, and you subtract the amount of RS from the carbs. Since I’m currently sticking to 100g of carbs a day, I want to make absolute certain so that I don’t dive into a vat of potatoes only to gain no less than three trillion pounds.

    Thanks for your time, and feel free to publicly shame me if this is all spelled out somewhere.

  27. So I just discovered at Whole Foods organic black bean pasta and organic red lentil pasta. Would this qualify as a good RS source? or because it probably was never soaked, should it be a pass?

    • tatertot says:

      I think it would qualify as a good source of RS. I wouldn’t want to use it as my sole source, but as an occasional food to run in the rotation it’s a great choice. Same as Konjac (shiritake) noodles, glass noodles, and brown rice noodles. We have them all now and then, and enjoy eating them cold the next day, too!

  28. tatertot says:

    Tom – If I didn’t love all your movies so much I’d shame you mercilessly…

    If you could accurately count the number of RS grams the food contained, you could theoretically deduct them from your carb count.

    For instance, a greenish, 200g, banana might have 20g of RS, so you could deduct that from the total carbs in that banana, BUT, the carb count will not match any standardized carb chart because the standard carb count is for a ripe banana.

    With beans, say you eat 100g and assume there are 12g of total carbs and 10g of RS. You could subtract and end up with 2g of carbs for that serving. Similar with potatoes, but it will be impossible to ever accurately predict the number of carb grams and RS grams in a particular food presented to you because there are so many variables.

    I would recommend counting all the RS calories as ‘carbs’. You won’t be off by more than 5-10% at the end of the day. If you are using a supplemental dose of potato starch, which is as pure of an RS source as you’ll find, you could safely not count the calories towards a carb goal.

    Hope that makes sense.

    Now, run, Forrest, run!

    • Richard S says:

      When counting carbs, how do you partition the fiber vs RS vs digestible starch when your are interested in “net” carbs. I assume any energy extracted from RS comes from the short chain fatty acids from colonic bacterial action, thus fat and not carb.

      Theoretical example: if I have 100g of cooked Jack’s Magic Beans with a listing of 20g total starch, 10g fiber and 4g RS, would “net” carbs be 10g (20 total-10 fiber), 6g (20 total-10 fiber-4g RS), something else?

    • tatertot says:

      It’s easy!

      Energy values of high amylose corn starches high in resistant starch (RS) were determined in vivo by two different methodologies. In one study, energy values were determined according to growth relative to glucose-based diets in rats fed diets containing RS(2), heat-treated RS(2) (RS(2)-HT), RS(3), and amylase predigested versions to isolate the RS component. Net metabolizable energy values ranged from 2.68 to 3.06 kcal/g for the RS starches, and 1.91-2.53 kcal/g for the amylase predigested versions. In a second study, rats were fed a diet containing RS(2)-HT and the metabolizable energy value was determined by bomb calorimetry. The metabolizable energy value was 2.80 kcal/g, consistent with Study 1. Thus, high amylose corn based RS ingredients and their amylase predigested equivalents have energy values approximately 65-78% and 47-62% of available starch (Atwater factor), respectively, according to the RS type

    • tatertot says:

      Just messin’

      From what I have seen, you can count every RS gram as 2.5 fat calories. That’s about as close as you’ll get without going crazy.

    • Im with you on the the RS and starches RS , but not on the CORN… corn is probably the highest crop with fungus.. one main reason its GMO to have the pesticides grow in it…(to try and lower it. ,,,, Most corn tested has high levels of mytoxcins aflatoxins http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/pp/notes/Corn/corn001.htm
      TWO things Ill never eat —corn and peanuts.
      these better foods then peanut butter = almond butter far better. Theres tons more sources of starches… go for all the others

      When you look at farming of the modern day, you build large silos , to store , grains and corn. sitting in a damp area growing mold/fungus add in all the problems they already have growing it.. A BIG PASS to me.. Ill eat any thing , rabbit, liver try any vegetable but the data is out there on the corn…

    • tatertot says:

      Eddie – that means a lot to me to hear you say that about corn and peanuts. I eat both (rarely) but your comments give me pause.

      Corn just pisses me off. Theoretically it should be one of the healthiest foods on the planet, and it fueled many civilizations for thousands of years. I think we’ve destroyed corn and made it not even suitable for animal food. I’d love to see a resurgence of heirloom, open-pollinated, non-GMO corn grown and nixtamalized as in the good ol’ days.

      If anyone gardens, look into Hooker’s Blue Corn. It grows well in home gardens and is probably the real-deal. I guess I should have posted that 3 months ago when people were planting their gardens, but here ya go!

      http://www.territorialseed.com/product/Hookers_Sweet_Indian_Organic_Corn_Seed/Organic_Corn_Seed

    • LaFrite says:

      @eddie
      I fully agree. The day I eat corn and peanuts is the day the choice is between dying of starvation or eat this stuff.

      On a parallel note, taste-wise, I am neutral with corn but peanuts I find truly disgusting. I don’t know why, so many friends and family like them. I can’t stand the taste of them. The worst that happened to me was to eat peanut mixed with chocolate in North-America. Everything was rancid about it and I almost puked. I did not see it was peanut butter wrapped in chocolate. I would rather eat marcipan wrapped in chocolate :)

      This reminds me of another thing: in my younger days, I traveled in North-America (Canada, US). I sometimes stopped by some 7-11 and got some Hershey bars of some kind. I was amazed at how different it tasted in Canada vs US. The US version always tasted rancid and I avoided it after a couple of tries at different spots.

    • Unfortunately, I grew up eating a lot of candy, 70 years ago. A real connoisseur! I remember a point. Maybe 40 years ago when the Hershey bars were randomly very fresh and very tasty or just stale depending on where you bought them. Soon thereafter they were all crappy.

    • LaFrite says:

      Yaaaaak!! For me, it was almost 20 years ago and I still remember the awfulness of it. Never again!

    • Frite

      When I was a kid, my favorite candy bar was Heath, an English toffee covered in chocolate. If I do ever get a candy in a specialty shop, it’s usually English toffee.

      So a few months back I was in a convenience store and on a lark, grabbed a Heath bar. Took one bite, tossed the rest. Awful. It’s like lite brown, fake toffee made of HFCS.

    • Richard,

      YES, Heath bars were the best! Ah the memories.

    • Tom Hanks says:

      Always great to meet a fan! But, if you should ever see me in public, please, leave me be.

      Thanks for clearing this up. It’s what I kind of figured but, as I said, I had also read the opposite… and I dared to dream. Dream that I could eat vats of potatoes and rice as far as the eye could see. Alas.

      There’s no crying in baseball. THERE’S NO CRYING IN BASEBALL. (Sorry, first thing that came to mind)

    • corn is said to have showed up 7000 years ago. 4000 to 6000 in the USA.. Im sure it was a different beast then… very good..Just all the mass producing hasnt helped it and the fast farming. I bet it was a great food—saved millions like potatoes in europe

      I also point to all the corn for toxins and mold/fugus people are consuming – Me I ate peanut butter all my life,..Up til getting sick at 38.. today im 41 –I eat a ton of no sugar almond butter…. No problems now. When you look at all the processed foods everything is soy lectin or corn syrup. Add in grains– stored the same way a big moldy silo.. you kind of see where im going. add all those factors I balk about– amoxicillin antibotics we all get— mold based…. the foods…high yeast diets (commercial yeasts)…corn syrup , soy lectin peanuts… corps fueled with toxins / molds all these factors , worn down gut,,,(from to many antibiotics , gluten ) you see how the problem gets out of control….MORE allergies, gut problems … add in non digestible starch leaking in…. from the other causes… you see why so may are screwed up. (blown out immune system) and gut.. The RS is good…but the few super blown guts bad

      It cracks me up Pepsi and coke sell there product in europe, mexico and Canada with sugar—– USA corn syrup. Eastern europe i believe has even less sugar in there sodas. If you want a coke, on a rare day– hit the international section at your food store (USA) they sell Mexican coke… I laughed at all the GMO, grass feed beef etc people(called them tree huggers until I got sick, and really stepped back and looked at everything..Now I eat real food , theres real bread— look up naturally leavened bread bread. Bread was made this way up to the late 50′s the bread takes 3 to 4 hrs to make the yeast/ naturally digest the grains(healthy) The new commercial bread 35 min– make mix drop in yeast POP its up and quick bake.( why I point to this also in foods) its surprising many places make the old style bread you just have to research a local bakery

      I also saw everything allergies(not just food but summer allergies- etc go away removing soy, grains and milk…

      milk is another beast grain feed vs grass feed… the fats are so different omega 3 vs 6 in the two. You ll see different genes in the two cows as well.

    • Oh, Jim Lowell, please do bring the Apollo safely home.
      It is Apollon, the son of Zeus.

    • thank the soy lectin thickener and the corn syrup …now its not what you use to eat .

  29. Golooraam says:

    Amazing info
    Just placed my second bowl of sprouted lentils in the fridge to have for dinner

    2 questions
    To clarify – on days I have RS3 rich foods – can I skip the PS? I slept w much less ‘music’ – crazy dreams though

    For fatloss – is there now any benefit to have a day w no carbs?

    • tatertot says:

      Sure, just get some RS most days and you’ll do fine. If you are trying to conquer some gut issues, try a bit harder.

      All kinds of diet plans with carb cycling. They all work to varying degrees for people, if you are trying to lose weight, play around with it and see how you do. Just don’t forget about feeding your gut bugs!

    • golooraam says:

      thanks TaterTot

      my fear of carbs has now morphed into fear of no resistant carbs – yikes! I hate this fear mentality…

      btw – any experience with RS4?
      I found in my closet this bag of Thermicarb which as far as the label goes is pure RS4

      unfortunately, the company went under

      any place else that makes you know of? (not wheat based though)

    • tatertot says:

      I’m staying away from RS4. I can’t really even comment on it other than it’s not natural, and used just in manufacturing processed foods.

      If you want to count and obsess over something, try counting total dietary fiber in fruits and veggies. You’ll find the higher the fiber, the lower the carbs, generally, so you should be able to stick to whatever carb goal you desire and get a good bit of fiber. Try on most days to have at least 1/2 cup of some type of beans and a greenish banana and most of your RS is taken care of.

      The last thing I want to do is create more things to worry about, just learn what foods contain RS and fiber and eat as many of them as you can fit into your plan.

      Don’t look at food labels to get your fiber…most of that is just filler material. Only count fiber from real food. Try it a few days, you’ll see what I mean. It gets you seeking out new food sources. Hardly any fiber in the veggies we are accustomed to eating, but some real surprises as well. There was a link in one of these blogs to a good fiber counter.

    • golooraam says:

      ah ok
      I won’t look into buy anymore
      I will also take your carb cycling advice in…
      TGFLentils!

      (also thanks for Richard for his ‘cook in broth’ suggestion)

  30. Considering that freezing bread creates RS, is it possible that freezing a plantain that isn’t as green as I would like it to be would turn some of the starch in it into resistant starch?

    • tatertot says:

      Sorry, James – just doesn’t work like that. The bread gets more RS because moisture is removed and the RS3 crystals for tighter bonds. With a green plantain, the RS is RS2, which are resistant due to their natural physical structure. Freezing should have no impact one way or the other on RS2.

      The freezing trick only works on food that has been cooked, thus destroying the natural RS2, creating RS3 when cooled.

  31. john Z says:

    Has anyone heard of KUDZU before? I have access to some kudzu starch and reading about it, well, it seems like it has RS.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kudzu

    • tatertot says:

      Yes, get some kudzu starch and try it! I’ve talked a lot about it, but usually it’s called ‘kuzu’ in the food sense. I just learned something new from your link:

      The roots contain starch, which has traditionally been used as a food ingredient in East Asia. In Vietnam, the starch called bột sắn dây is flavoured with pomelo oil and then used as a drink in the summer. In Japan, the plant is known as kuzu and the starch named kuzuko. Kuzuko is used in dishes including kuzumochi, mizu manjū, and kuzuyu. It also serves as a thickener for sauces, and can substitute for cornstarch

      So, another Horchata de Chufa-type drink and another instance of people utilizing raw starch granules in their traditional diet.

      I have no idea the RS content, though. Kudzu root is used heavily in Traditional Chinese Medicine.

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21315814

  32. JustinR says:

    As I learned a while back from Richard, I bake my potatoes ahead of time and immediately stick in the refrigerator to cool.

    On my two heavy weightlifting days, I bring one of these pre-baked potatoes to work to eat for lunch after the workout. I warm it up in the microwave on low power level with butter and blue cheese on top. I then add half a container of cottage cheese on top.

    Am I getting any RS this way from my cooked/cooled potatoes?

    Also, where have we landed on the potato skin? Do we still need to avoid it where possible? Or not that big of a deal?

    Thanks.

  33. Is RS1 destroyed by heating?

    I just bought some zucchini squash and cucumber, would those be a decent source of RS1?

    • tatertot says:

      James – my first reaction was, ‘there’s no RS in cucumbers, dummy!’, but wait…you are eating the seeds. Good call!

      While probably not a ‘decent’ source of RS, it is surely a source, assuming the seeds can protect the contents until they get to the large intestine. Usually cucumbers and squash are eaten in their immature stage when the seeds aren’t really hardened, so hard to say.

      I wouldn’t necessarily count on squash and cucumbers for RS, but they are good for you in the fiber department and have edible seeds that contain good prebiotic qualities.

      RS1 is somewhat heat resistant as long as the seed or grain remains intact. For instance, ‘whole grains’ or just crushed grains make it hard for the digestive enzymes of the small intestine to degrade it completely, allowing some starch to arrive in the colon whole where it serves as gut bug food. This is pretty much the big problem with what we’ve done with flour over the last several hundred years, we’ve developed ways to refine it finer and finer, making tastier foods, but it all gets digested in the SI and never makes it to the LI. Any naturally indigestible bits are removed, further making refined flour a bad food choice.

    • Thanks Tim!

      Do you think it’s theoretically possible to cook and cool something enough times that all the starch turns into RS3?

    • tatertot says:

      Well, there are about 500+ patents for processes that do just that: http://www.google.com/patents/US5281276

      For home use, keep in mind it’s all about diminishing returns. The first healting/cooling cycle will net about 75% of the RS3 you’ll ever get from a conversion. Repeated cycles increase it slightly, but never anywhere close to the first cycle.

      Takeaway is, pre-cook starchy foods and store in fridge or freezer until ready to use. If there are leftovers from that, put them back in the fridge or freezer and eat later.

      “Leftovers” are typically shunned, I know they were in my house growing up. The new paradigm is we should be purposely creating “leftovers” to eat primarily. Sure, eat some fresh, hot fried potatoes…I had some last night for dinner, but I made a big batch and the rest are merrily cooling and retrograding in my fridge as we speak. I’ll probably have them as home fries Saturday morning with a side of bacon and cooked in the bacon grease.

    • Okay thanks Tim. Does the RS3 increase over time during the first cooling or is it at the max content as soon as it hits a certain temperature?

      Meaning, if I cool some plantain pancakes is the RS3 content as high as it’s gonna get once it’s at the temperature of the fridge or will it continue to increase overnight?

  34. tatertot says:

    It’s time, temp, and humidity driven. 8 hours at 40F in a dry refrigerator will produce most of the RS3 that will ever be produced. Further cooling to 10F for 20 days will eke out that last 25%.

    • Alright thanks a lot Tim really appreciate you taking the time to answer.

    • One last question Tim – if I get joint / skin symptoms with fructans, is giving psyllium husk a try worth it?

    • By fructans I mean inulin – onions, garlic, beets, broccoli.

      If I got symptoms could it be I was eating too much inulin? Should I try just having a very small amount with my green plantain?

      Also, I haven’t tried potato starch yet because of nightshades – not sure if it’s a worthy concern, do you have an opinion? I cut out nightshades because my autoimmune disease.

    • tatertot says:

      You’ll just have to play with it and see how you do!

    • james,

      many foods are also are anti fungal or antimicrobial
      which can effect you if you have a problem from my experience, onions messed me up 2 years ago.. now I eat every other day..two onions cooked with my eggs..

      you can also have food intolerance’s from weak immune system and bad gut barrier

      Can you eat asparagus???? this has inulin

      potato is a night shade many with problems with night shades have problem with red green yellow peppers??? can you eat them
      I found I can eat these all day–not talking RS but night shades

  35. RS for Dummies says:

    Just getting into this RS thing… I regularly eat waffles made with a large amt of potato starch. i make them in big batches and then freeze them for use later. does this process leave any significant amts of RS?

    • tatertot says:

      More than likely it has a good bit of RS. I’d be hesitant to wager a guess, though, but raw starches, baked, seem to hang onto RS2 and also create RS3.

  36. Here’s one I haven’t seen anybody comment on. I’ve been supplementing PS for over a year now… no negative issues. For the past month, I’ve added green banana flour to the rotation. I.E. 2-3 tbsp PS/1-2 tbsp banana flour daily (1/2 of this amount in the morning & the other 1/2 before dinner). Each time I’ve done this, I’ve become very fatigued in the afternoon/early evening & somewhat depressed. No fatigue on the days I have only PS (4 tbsp). Any ideas?

    • tatertot says:

      Automotive Engineer vs. Vanilla Ice Cream

      A complaint was received by the Pontiac Division of General Motors: “This is the second time I have written you, and I don’t blame you for not answering me, because I kind of sounded crazy, but it is a fact that we have a tradition in our family of ice cream for dessert after dinner each night. But the kind of ice cream varies so, every night, after we’ve eaten, the whole family votes on which kind of ice cream we should have and I drive down to the store to get it. It’s also a fact that I recently purchased a new Pontiac and since then my trips to the store have created a problem. You see, every time I buy vanilla ice cream, when I start back from the store my car won’t start. If I get any other kind of ice cream, the car starts just fine. I want you to know I’m serious about this question, no matter how silly it sounds: ‘What is there about a Pontiac that makes it not start when I get vanilla ice cream, and easy to start whenever I get any other kind?’”

      The Pontiac President was understandably skeptical about the letter, but sent an engineer to check it out anyway. The latter was surprised to be greeted by a successful, obviously well educated man in a fine neighborhood. He had arranged to meet the man just after dinner time, so the two hopped into the car and drove to the ice cream store. It was vanilla ice cream that night and, sure enough, after they came back to the car, it wouldn’t start.

      The engineer returned for three more nights. The first night, the man got chocolate. The car started. The second night, he got strawberry. The car started. The third night he ordered vanilla. The car failed to start.

      Now the engineer, being a logical man, refused to believe that this man’s car was allergic to vanilla ice cream. He arranged, therefore, to continue his visits for as long as it took to solve the problem. And toward this end he began to take notes: he jotted down all sorts of data, time of day, type of gas used, time to drive back and forth, etc.

      In a short time, he had a clue: the man took less time to buy vanilla than any other flavor. Why? The answer was in the layout of the store. Vanilla, being the most popular flavor, was in a separate case at the front of the store for quick pickup. All the other flavors were kept in the back of the store at a different counter where it took considerably longer to find the flavor and get checked out.

      Now the question for the engineer was why the car wouldn’t start when it took less time. Once time became the problem — not the vanilla ice cream — the engineer quickly came up with the answer: vapor lock. It was happening every night, but the extra time taken to get the other flavors allowed the engine to cool down sufficiently to start. When the man got vanilla, the engine was still too hot for the vapor lock to dissipate.

      Moral of the story: Even insane looking problems are sometimes real.

    • @tatertot
      “Even insane looking problems are sometimes real.”

      You should have told me this much earlier.

    • james london says:

      I like that story. The old correlation is not causation is thing is also a bugger when it comes to symptoms.

      My 5th and final crappy symptom (after asthma, reduced exercise endurance, brain fog/depression, pruritus ani) was an under-arm rash that’s been intermittent since last Oct. It’s appeared a few weeks after the first time I tried PS and has vaguely followed my cycle of stop-starting PS. To check for causation I’ve been off PS for a good 5 weeks or so now and the rash continues to come and go. So maybe it was nothing to do with PS. Or maybe it initiated the rash but stopping PS isn’t enough for it to clear up.

    • james I ll email you… you my friend may be one of the 5- to 10 percent who need to start from the ground up

    • james london says:

      Eddie if that was to me I think there was another James asking you to email him? Thanks anyway!

      But if you think the same advice applies to me I am going to wean myself off corticosteroids (been on for asthma – some say they do as much harm as antibiotics) and see if I improve. If not will go for a more methodical approach with test.

      I traced all this back to big mercury filling which was taken out last Dec, and I’m expecting recovery to be slow. I have seen some slight improvements.

      I forgot one symptom – post nasal drip / coughing / mucus which I have nearly all the time.

    • James London,

      Yeah a different james….You I bet have antibodies to yeast… steroids allow yeast to grow.. so do antibiotics.. Careful my friend.. playing and removing —-But I will tell you, my buddy he had an inhaler he is 39 started in high school … He cut out all yeast foods , beer, grains and slowly got off his inhaler… hes eating tons of veggies… “””starches””” you hear me promote it RS and meats , chicken etc TAKING a probiotic renew life 50 billion….-He said this year was the first year he has had no seasonal allergies… he said his nose ran for 5 months when he stopped the inhalers and removed eating all those foods.

      he also , used seatgates olive leaf spray and nutribiotic grapefruit seed extract spray.. both kill pretty much anything

      Hes on clud NINE… HE EATS STARCHES — but cut out any yeast food….or gluten

      I say the sinus drip is full of nasty stuff… running down your throat re infecting you

    • James Lonon,

      As well I my self, removed all my mercury fillings 2 .5 years ago…reading deep– yeast seem to love these…. best thing i ever did

      Me – I had post nasal drip / coughing / mucus nearly all my life time. I started hacking and spiting in 6 grade.. As well waking up in the morning. Hacking out stuff for the first 10 mins.
      *************** Today it is all gone ZERO********

      if you have a spouse have them look at you at night while you sleep… I bet money you are a mouth breather all night and wake up congested. This doesnt help….Your inhaler is to reduce inflammation but your not getting to the cause.
      once the sinus drains out … all the nasal drip stops youll be able to breather thru your nose… once this happens you need to train your self to breathe again thru your nose….while you sleep

    • gabkad says:

      Eddie, please tell me this is a typo:
      ‘As well I my self, removed all my mercury fillings 2 .5 years ago…reading deep– yeast seem to love these…. best thing i ever did’

    • gabkad,

      many say they love the mercury (its not really silver) the fillings. There is no way for sure to say , as I didnt document that part well…but ripped out 4 of them..,, and for me it seemed a lot better in my mouth sinus etc from that point… that was the first thing I did in my gut repair process…..replaced the 4 I have with the white…. For me I see the relation of gut/sinus I worked on both… off base but I went to the ent several times in this process , they looked in and never saw anything(in my ear), I said my ear hurt , they tested the pressure etc..nothing I was loosing my hearing to. The guy said i can put you on some antibiotics ( I laughed) I started tea tree oil, coconut oil , some others …the pain went away slowly..then 7 months later…this bio film thing fell out.. I took a picture of it. be happy to show it…HAHAH was like plastic wrap , For me , it was a wake up call…thinking the same thing can happen in the gut.(bio film) be happy to share
      Hope I dont freak anyone out hahah,,im just a regular dude…you can facebook me and see eddie belschner anyway heres a link on fillings..I say best money spent.

      http://www.yeastinfection.org/is-your-yeast-infection-caused-by-mercury-fillings/#.U5t5ykAYlN0

    • tatertot says:

      OK, I’m on-board, getting ready to yank mine out myself, too. Will this work:
      http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=makita+lxt239&tag=mh0b-20&index=aps&hvadid=3483250536&ref=pd_sl_7v33eg0rzz_bb or should I just use rusty pliers? Wish me luck! Hope it doesn’t hurt too much. What should I stick in the hole? Potato starch?

      Just messing with ya, Eddie!

    • Why are they after the mercury? Who needs it? Cui bono?

    • eddie,

      were the fillings on the same side where the ear?

      Methylated mercury.

      Possibly some Archaea involved?

    • tatertot,
      you had me laughing pretty good!!!

    • I believe 2 were on each side…..One of them when I had it drilled out they cracked… sent for a root canal . after going there drilling down to clean out…, I ended up pulling it ,, as they ended up cracking it.. I ended up doing a bone graft.. then dental implant 3600.00 dollars later..

      I opened a can of worms I guess….but in the long run, I feel like I was lucky it cracked, I would rather have it pulled then a dead tooth (filled with bacteria in the bottom) in my mouth from what I have learned.

  37. Question – I first started taking ps without the probiotics but have now been taking the probiotics for the last 8 months or so. I am going to start incorporating rs food into my diet instead of the ps but I was wondering if I need to keep taking the probiotics? We do have a large veggie garden, raise our own broiler chickens, rabbits and have laying hens so I think I have ‘dirty’ enough lifestyle to skip them. Do you think I should take them in the winter though when the gardening is over and the chickens and rabbits are in the freezer?

    • tatertot says:

      Kelly, really good observations.

      No one should need probiotics or potato starch, but both are kind of hedges against poor diet and lifestyle. I have a couple bottles of different probiotics that I just take randomly, not at all now that I’m outside so much and eating tons of fresh veggies. I think through Winter I’ll start back, but I don’t think I really NEED to.

      Same as potato starch. On days when I end up eating less than stellar, I’ll have a nightcap smoothie w/PS and some other fun stuff I have lying around, but those days are getting more spread out. We’re getting ready to go on vacation and will be eating out a lot, PS will be in my suitcase and I hope I get the chance to have to explain it to some zit-faced TSA ‘enforcer’.

      I think the ultimate goal for everyone should be to eat real foods, supplement sparingly, and maintain a trouble-free gut.

  38. Apparently antibiotics are not the only theat do the bacteria. Right now there’s a trend to spray food with antibacterial viruses.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=2464943&page=1#.UAcNZ3CwUXw

  39. Mike Ede says:

    Okay, willing to try the bean thing, but have no idea where to start. Obviously Google is my friend for bean recipes but from the point of view of maximizing RS do I cook, cool and eat cold? Are tinned beans okay? Is there a hierarchy of beans? Pretty much the only things I have ever eaten with beans are chilli and baked beans (preferably Heinz!) Presumably chilli plus cold rice is a pretty good double whammy on the RS side?

    • agatha says:

      All kinds of beans are delicious cooked, cooled and crushed with olive oil, salt, lemon juice and any herbs or spices you fancy – like a kind of houmous. I believe cooking and cooling forms the RS3. You can reheat without damaging the RS3 but eating beans hot in a stew or chili doesn’t give much RS. Eat the stew cold as leftovers with a nice flatbread and you have yourself some RS.

    • cobalt says:

      Agatha if you do this, do you have to soak the beans for a while before cooking?
      Also, if you do soak for certain beans, do you cook them in the same water, or with fresh water?
      Thanks so much for the hummus idea!

  40. A report:

    Husband got heartburn from potato starch, plantain flour, green banana flour, beans.

    Took lots of all the probiotic pills for a while. Now eating beans daily as well as the other cooked and cooled rs rich foods. Fermented food or bev with each meal and as many veg as I can cram onto the plate. Only taking the pills very sporatically.

    So. Able to comfortably consume beans and yesterday he observed that he is hardly getting any leg cramps from working hard in The garden. Used to be that he would have to take magnesium almost daily after garden work.

    • tatertot says:

      Ellen, great report, thanks! Hope he works barefoot and eats dirty radishes, too.

      When the gubbermint came out with their recommendations for 28g/day of fiber, they were onto something. If people would have implemented this advice with beans and crammed veggies in their pie-hole instead of pie, we wouldn’t be having any of these discussions now.

      I figure in my SAD days, I was eating the usual 15g/day of ‘fiber’ that was in bread and cookies and my daily FIBERONE bar. When I went paleo, that figure dropped to probably 5g/day.

      It was easier to avoid fiber than to learn whether it should be deducted from my net carbs and all that fishy math…besides, do the calcs, not much fiber in your standard salad bar salad.

      The first scoop of potato starch I ate last year was probably the first time since I was weaned that my colon saw a huge wave of butyrate. My gut bugs all held hands and shouted to my brain, ‘Tell everyone about this, please!’

      I like that we are refining the ideas and digging into real-food solutions. It was disappointing to me that not everyone responded to potato starch, so I’m really happy when I hear about people who are implementing a ‘real food’ fiber and RS strategy.

    • tator,

      you know—reading this… you say you went paleo…How long did you eat this way??? Im in no way indorsing PALEO… but , if you did this a good amount of time, Like I did, Im thinking you cleared out some bad gut stuff( we know LOW carb and paleo kills gut stuff) , setting your self up for the RS and for the RS to really take off . Starting a mega feeding frenzy..your gut was ready and in the mode for enhancement .
      why I say some of these diets in my eyes in stages help leading to RS.. just kind what Ive seen in my self( for extreme screwed folks) I went Paleo then low carb/high fat , and switched massive fiber to now adding in starch from nuts and small sources.. ( I always ate from the start massive inulin thou) I actually ate some potato yesterday (even thou I havent tested( all my crazy immune tests–which will be soon*** potato in came as the worst for me–it got to the point my nose would bleed) I had killer GAS laughing and killing my co worker yesterday… but didnt seem to have any problems–like I did in the past….

      I think I have lead my gut up to this point…

    • No, he doesn’t go barefoot, but his clothes and body are saturated with dirt by the end of the day, fingernails are black and we only lightly wipe off the carrots and radishes we are not going to ferment or otherwise cook. So this puts a new spin on all that laundry I have to do!!

      I think the potato starch experiments have had a lot of merit. The fact that it did not work for everyone raises a lot of good questions that will ultimately lead to some solutions for very sick people. Plus I think it can show you that you have sub optimal flora when you otherwise think things are fine. Harvey had no obvious problems eating the PHD diet for four years before this RS exploration. But there are so many things that we think are just the way things are and don’t realize they are clues to less than optimal health. We never really considered that the. Muscle cramps were telling him something could be improved. And who knows what that improvement means for other long term, less obvious aspects of his health. Is he absorbing all minerals better? The effects could be very far reaching…..

  41. Tatertot and Richard,

    A good article for you guys on root veggies , and fungus…( not a negative fungus) soil based
    Im not a fungus fan :) but this seems good–helps the bacteria join to enhance the crops

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/next/nature/more-food-with-microbes/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mycorrhiza

    • tatertot says:

      I’m better at growing tomatoes than fixing people.

      I actually am trying the Mycorrhiza this year, found this at Home Depot: http://www.xtreme-gardening.com/products/mykos Put it on 1/2 my tomatoes transplants.

      I also sprinkled L. plantarum on seed flats and saw about double the normal germination rates.

      Did you know most of the antibiotics we use today were discovered by a soil scientist, Selman Waksman? His goal was better plants, when he saw how they were being used he said, ‘That will never work, you idiots! Widespread antibiotic resistance will result.’

      Why can’t people respond like my garden vegetables? Or do they?

    • tator ,

      I think they do..just at different steps.. I look at my gut as a moldy orange(before)… Using the BIFIDO and Lact multi strains 10 to 14 of them I ve slowly put stuff back….dropping the mold while using things to hold back the mold(herbs etc- some drugs (nystatin a SBO really)… I say they work..and working proof( bacteria like you use on your plants ..

      This Selman Waksman , I think hes right –this amoxicillin (mold/yeast) in my eyes is f-ing up everyone and there then creating more antibodies ( to yeasts), to more foods soy grains and milk like mold/yeast proteins…. since there similar Like I say , in the end I hope to add more soil based SBO’s to finish the job , with action bacteria — so these will do the final job and block the mold , not the herbs and crap i used..to get where i am… I m close.

      But on a FUNNY ASS note…. check out this bacteria soap people are experimenting with.. Some dont take a shower at all…they say the bacteria on the soap keeps them clean…HAHAH would you try it????..I might down the ROAD( for laughs ) … interesting thou .. makes sense!!!! http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/25/magazine/my-no-soap-no-shampoo-bacteria-rich-hygiene-experiment.html?_r=0

    • Wilbur says:

      @tatertot

      I have no idea where to place this. I read a pop piece about the following study, and thought of you and your bacteroides. It seems they might protect themselves and others when confronted with some antibiotics. Just in case you hadn’t seen it…

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24867962/?i=3&from=bacteroides%20antibiotic%20resistance

  42. Does anybody know if cooking increases or somehow makes more bioavailable the pectin in an apple ?

    • LaFrite says:

      Ellen,

      In this doc about the science of jam making (http://www2.ca.uky.edu/hes/fcs/factshts/FN-SSB.110.pdf ) they say that cooking pectin for too long or at too high heat will destroy it.

      So I suppose that pectin is not increased by cooking. If you think about something similar to RS3, remember that this has to do with the moisture content of the RS-rich food.

  43. Thanks la Frite,

    But it also does say that fruit must be heated for the pectin to become water soluble and gelling to occur. So it seems to be a Goldilocks thing….gotta hit that sweet spot.

    A friend has been having some amazing results healing from a disastrous encounter with abx with treatment from an Ayurvedic doc. Stewed apples were part of the (very complex and specific) regimen and was told that they must be cooked, raw apples simply would not do.

    • @Ellen – isn’t it that cooking fruit causes freeing of methanol, thain in a raw state is bound to pectin? Methanol is a poison. One of the reasons not to drink commercial heated fruit juices or canned fruit.
      Gut bacteria can free methanol from pectin too, but it’s likely to end up as a methane or formic acid finally.

  44. It looks to me like the methanol is released when the pectin breaks down, which would be the case in the scenario LaFrite mentioned…when the fruit is cooked too long or at too high a heat. Gentle stewing would seem to be different… So are you proposing that a freshly cooked home stewed apple would be dangerous???? This is getting a little too science-y for me. But that just sounds silly!

  45. Anthony says:

    Hi Eddie,

    I was referred to you by Tim Steele from another thread on this site.

    Maybe you can help or have some insight; here is my long story summed up a lot.

    I’ve had ulcerative colitis for about 10 years now- I’m 31 year old male about 5-11, 165 pounds now. When healthy I was 190 and in great shape, but since UC diagnosis and ultimately what I always believed and now know through organix test, this is a yeast issue and my motility is not what it was, 2 nice size pretty solid stools every day, is now gone to one day can’t have a BM and next day liquid with blood and mucus.

    So through metametrix I had the organix testing done. It stated I have c.diff toxin b in my small intestine and states it’s an overgrowth and numbers were ‘very high.’ Didn’t state any other issues or bacterial issues, strickly yeast/c.diff overgrowth. I do have silver fillings in my mouth and suspect possible mercury but belle yeast is my main issue. I have all the sibo symptoms and also my sweat and skin oxidize so quickly on my face…any reason or cause of this? Oxidation is very rapid and strange with my hair and face; it’s either oxidizing or it’s keratin balls or keratosis pilaris.

    Should I replace my fillings and if so, with what type of filling or should I get fake teeth? I’m so susceptible to cavities these last few years and before this would never get cavities. I don’t get it.

    Should I take amazing grass, PS, AND Pysillium right after I eat or before I eat? I’m not sure exactly how to take this?

    As for this yeast, nothing has worked and thinking of doing oral fecal capsules along with enzymes…. Anything you recommend as c.diff is my issue in the small bowel!!

    Thank you so much! Anthony

    • Anthony,

      first I am no doctor, I d be happy to share some tips and experiences ive had . As well as the things Ive done that have helped me out. We are all different, there is no one cure for all with the gut, but I d be happy to share .

      If you facebook me with a message..with your email I ll send you a message.. If your taking alot or have been taking immune suppressant drugs for your Colitis – this may explain the BIG up tick in cavities . This seems to be a major side effect with many of IBS drugs,..DONT stop your drugs….I wouldn’t go crazy and start pulling stuff out of your mouth..

      I wouldnt be surprised to hear , you had some event in life you got sick– took tons of antibiotics(from doc),,and now you have c diff.. and yeast over growth…
      Send me a message eddie belschner (facebook)

  46. I just started eating brown rice syrup because it is a carbohydrate source with no fructose or digestible starch – just glucose. I get bloated from fructose and joint problems from starch. Is this a bad idea? Some people have said that white rice is the same thing – is there any reason to believe that white rice wouldn’t have the same negative effects on me as starch from tubers?

  47. Leslie says:

    Another sinus query from me, in case people want to skip this.

    I have already asked Richard about how his sinuses were after doing this for a while, and he said they are good. Mine are, too. SO much better then they used to be, but there are some lingering issues.

    Briefly, I am wanting thoughts on saccharomyces boulardii & kombucha while looking to clear up the last of a sinus infection.

    bit of back story:

    Grew up in am American, medical household. I was given A LOT of antibiotics. By age 9 I was already allergic to Ceclor & Penicillin. At one point I was put on Accutane for my skin for 6 months, then one of the tetracyclines for over a year. Any time I began to develop a URI I was put on antibiotics (I think Zithromax or whatever it is). Also, I grew up eating a pretty standard american diet with plenty of wheat & sugar. Sinus got worse overall and by age 14 I had asthma.

    Ok, so that gives you an idea of how wrecked I am thinking my gut biome is. not to mention my sinuses. Late 30′s now, been paleo for 4 years, went low-carb for about 2 of those. With paleo many things improved. Once I finally got wise to this RS thing (thanks to everyone here), things got even better. I have been taking the 3 main probiotics, drinking kombucha, eating more fermentable fibers, PS, dried green plantains, green bananas (no beans or lentils yet). I have been doing this since January this year. I had just got over a bad sinus infection over NYE and though this would be the thing to help fix me. Sinuses overall on this protocol were even more improved day to day. Allergies were better when spring hit, but by mid summer they were coming back. I thought I had that fixed but I guess not. still, overall amazingly better. However, a week ago I got a cold, it eventually found its way in to my sinuses, and the cold left but my sinuses are still not back to 100%.

    So, reading Eddie’s story here (thank you as well for all this information), I am wondering if I need to try a few other things. I am adding grapefruit seed extract to my sinus rinses (NeilMed), and I just ordered some olive leaf spray based on his recommendation. but hearing form others about saccharomyces boulardii improving their sinuses, I am wondering if I need more of that then I am getting from Primal Defence? Also, what does everyone think of kombucha in all of this? Could it be doing more harm then good here?

    Thank you to anyone who read this far, and thank you to everyone; richard, taterto, Dr. Grace, Eddie and many more, who have contributed to all of this.

    Cheers,

    Leslie

    • Leslie,

      Good to hear your better…..you have pretty much fixed your gut!!!!! remember bacteria and yeast/fungus can live in the gut, sinus ( nose and ears, As well anywhere from the mouth to anus

      You may need to work harder on your nose and sinus , harder then others( like my self) 20 years of sinus issues dont got away easy. Some times you cant fix the ears and sinus alone from eating( my experience)

      Buy the grapefruit seed extract nasal spray
      http://www.allhealthtrends.com/citricidal-nasal-spray.html?gdftrk=gdfV2281_a_7c328_a_7c1040_a_7c
      and the olive leaf spray
      http://www.swansonvitamins.com/seagate-olive-leaf-nasal-spray-1-fl-oz-liquid?SourceCode=INTL405&CAWELAID=449666509&mkwid=X97lE9EH&pcrid=54347464567&gclid=CjwKEAjw0a2eBRDVrabv9vWJ90USJACsKRDHIjsn4uahycO5FRzaV2cKFmsKUHJjz1sR2_SPt7PUlRoCyq3w_wcB

      Rotate them …for a while

      These will do wonders!!!!!! as well grapefruit seed / tea tree oil drops for the ears.
      http://www.swansonvitamins.com/seagate-olive-leaf-nasal-spray-1-fl-oz-liquid?SourceCode=INTL405&CAWELAID=449666509&mkwid=X97lE9EH&pcrid=54347464567&gclid=CjwKEAjw0a2eBRDVrabv9vWJ90USJACsKRDHIjsn4uahycO5FRzaV2cKFmsKUHJjz1sR2_SPt7PUlRoCyq3w_wcB

      Your sinus will get worse before better as all the crap gets flushed out… it took 7 months left side and 12 months right side..(nose) I also was loosing my hearing — ENT checked me ( bad ringing) never found anything. He wanted to give me more antibiotics ( I SAID KISS OFF ) one year later some strange BIO Film fell out of my ear….. I d be happy to send anyone a photo of it… Ringing is gone— hearing lose stopped.. sinus best in my life

      People say good things about yeast saccharomyces boulardii < IM no fan– If your body has created antibodies to yeast/fungus say candida or bakers / brewers yeast then I dont know. Bakers brewers yeast is simular in structure to saccharomyces boulardii

      I also follow doug kauffman — he says NO.. I follow alot of stuff and have combined everyone– RS, low carb ,NO yeast (doug K) paleo… all are tools to get you to health used at the right time and portion.
      http://www.knowthecause.com is dougs site

      A good study , tossed under the rung my big pharma A good read for you– http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1999/09/990910080344.htm

      7

    • I would say try going without the kombucha for a good long time and see what you notice.

      If you have any fungal issues it would be better to stick to bacterial fermented things, like yogurt and especially fermented vegetables, according to Paul Jamiet.

      Another thing about Kobucha is that

    • Jump over to doug kauffman— the go to guy on fungus , lives and breaths this for over 20 years

      I d pass on the the yogurt, from what he says( depending where the fungus is — it will feed it( as its broken down as sugar….odds are the stomach acid will break it down before it has any good effect (turn to sugar)
      If your going to try yogurt may work for you — make SCD yogurt ( make at home) the long fermented process takes all lactose out of it…..and youll have billions of good bacteria Vs the store crap then only very low millions ( if you buy some with any candy — fruit and crap in it ) you canceled out the tiny effect it had) go for SCD yogurt ( google it ) or you tube it) very easy to make — you buy a yogurmart machine

      I did this for 7 months – unitl I found in testing the yeast were eating the yogurt — I go good bacteria –but gave the candida I had lots of food…..I stopped
      Now I get my bacteria from renew life 80 billion ( free of many things)

    • man sorry for the type o’s from my phone

      should be” ID go for good bacteria :

    • Leslie says:

      Thanks Ellen.

      The kombucha is store bought, but I will give it a rest for a while. Too bad, I really do like that stuff as a drink :)

      Side note, if you know; what would be a good alcohol to go for? If one were to go out and drink, would wine be ok? Better to avoid ciders, I am thinking, but perhaps spirits would be the best due to the sugar content. Just thought I would ask ;)

    • Leslie says:

      Hi Eddie -

      Thank you for your reply, and don’t worry about the spelling, mine is not any good.

      Just wondering, any thoughts on taking independent saccharomyces boulardii? Worth it? Best to avoid?

      Sounds as though I should steer clear of yoghurt and stick to fermented veg. I had been having small amounts of store-bought, full-fat, plain goat or sheep’s milk yoghurt which I used to mix with the PS along with some alma powder, matcha and Amazing Grass super berry powder. However, I will leave the yoghurt out for a while and see how things go.

      Thank you both for the replies.

    • Leslie says:

      Eddie -

      Thanks again, really, this is all very helpful and much appreciated.

      Olive leaf spray is on order, I will actually order the GSE spray as well to have both on hand.

      I will skip the saccharomyces boulardii. I came across some anecdotal evidence and thought, “I tried everything else, so why not?”, but it sounds as thought I have NOT tried everything else.

      Thanks for the study link. I actually had found & read that, but I kinda thought to myself, “Why would I have this problem?”, and looking at other studies decided perhaps I was not one of the ones who had fungal issues with my sinuses. Again, sounds like I need to test some other things out.

      I will say, antibiotics are no where on my list. Here in the UK my GP, the last time I had a discussion with him about my overall sinus issues said to me, “I don’t see a problem, even if you get 4 – 5 infections a year, just take some antibiotics and you will be ok.” uhhhh …. what?! No sir. No thank you. So, I am doing what I can myself to fix things, and I think I am on my way to getting better.

      I will report back, if anyone is interested, about how I get on with the olive leaf & GSE items, both nose & ears.

      Thanks again.

    • Leslie

      To many antibiotics cause yeast/fungus over growth candida…. along with kill off all your good bacteria TO block bad bacteria and yeast…

      add in to much sugar and processed foods—- and life long problem sinus etc…your screwed and stuck in a circle. One day the avg Doc will learn they causing more problem.. The said thing 90 percent of and INCLUDING many GI docs dont tell you diet maters when you have problems or to take an Probiotic 2hrs after your antibotic ( and cut back on sugar ) when taking them.

      If you have fungus in your sinus…your NOSE will drain like crazy — stuff for a while while taking the nose sprays.

      You find your ENT , knows nothing really about fungus…. as well your GI.. they laugh at the thought something else lives in you other then Bacteria( they dont learn much if at all on it.
      google 16S rRNA bacteria testing

      then look at 18S rRNA fungus testing you will be surprised of all the AIRBORNE things and testing….yet your ENT hasnt come around yet.

    • Lauren says:

      The sinuses/nasal passages have a biofilm just like the gut. You may need a biofilm disrupter locally. Chris Kresser has some good info on it. Xylitol is one. You can make a liquid of water with xylitol, baking soda and sea salt and use it in a neti pot (or just with your cupped hand) to disrupt the biofilm. You could then do the GSE or colloidal silver, etc. It may be the one step you’re missing. Good luck!

  48. Ha! I thought I erased that last line. basically I was just going to say that homemade kombucha can, over time, acquire other organisms, depending on what is in the air in your house.

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