The Whole Logic Behind the Milk Intervention, Part 1

I didn’t take much stock in the opening of this guy’s account of his experience—that of dropping 33 pounds in six weeks—when I read it the first time.

I really shouldn’t tell you this. My wife wasn’t sure about it, my friends just laugh, but I’d like to let you in on the secret anyway. It is risky telling so many people, because if it doesn’t work, you’ll never let me forget it. But, being a notorious risk-taker plus an eternal optimist, I still feel like letting you in on it. I know it will work. I’m not afraid. The worst part is that even when it works, some people will still think I’m crazy. Oh well, I’m used to that by now.

That ought resonate a bit with paleo peeps I should think. I only didn’t take stock because, what’s new? Unless one is willing to just sit by and get spoon fed information, then one is surely to be going against established, conventional dogma (I’ve dropped the “wisdom” schtick), and what’s left? In the last couple of weeks I’ve been enamored of seeing the reaction to what all I’m on about with my milk intervention. On the one hand, 400+ new subscribers to the newsletter and on the other hand, the trolls. Those interested are magnitudes more in numbers, so let’s take a very deep look at the logic underlying all of this from my own perspective. What only matters to me is whether it makes fundamental sense or not, from what I generally think of as: A Human Animal Perspective.

  1. Everyone knows we ought to avoid dairy in general and milk in particular. It’s not Paleo—and for the low carb folks, has too many carbs.
  2. No other mammal drinks the milk of another mammal and doesn’t drink milk at all beyond weaning.
  3. Milk has “stuff” in it that may do “bad shit” to you.

It’s Not paleo

Neither are any number of things paleos eat. Coconut oil? Ghee? Were paleos refining and processing coconut oil, how about ghee and olives into oil? And how come cheese all over the place is, well, “we’re not really talking about it,” but milk is just too far: Richard, you’ve gone too far! Indeed. Paleos in general seem to have little trepidation about dairy products reduced and refined to fat & protein, i.e., those where lactose has largely been fermented out. It’s really those damned low-carbers eh? :)

…Whole milk, very roughly, is about 50% fat, 30% carbohydrate, and 20% protein.

Has anyone ever stopped to consider what might be a reasonable model upon which to generally base a lifelong diet, specifically BECAUSE of the rough macronutrient composition of milk? From what I see beyond the complete avoidance of dairy on paleo grounds (fine) seems no reason to avoid the substrate—milk—if “you do dairy.” Let’s just be honest: it’s the irrational fear over any amount of sugar in your diet, even though it’s obviously essential to infant mammals. Right? That’s you’re argument? “I’m an adult, adults can’t do sugar like witto teeny babies can and must.” Right, “adult?”

No Other Mammal Drinks the Milk of Another Mammal, and Not At All Beyond Weaning

In the first phrase, that’s simply dumb. Unless we’re going full cannibal, we have to eat other animals and I find the distinction between the obvious fact that their muscle, fat, bone (broths), marrow, brain tissue, and organs are oh-so healthy…but their milk is poison….to be worse than ignorant on more levels of plain honest inquiry than I could count. It’s just dismissible dogma, at base, that causes people—even Paleos—to spout such udder nonsense. Because when you get that far, the next question to ask is: what if their milk is the most nutritionally sound at large? It seems like an immanently reasonable question to me, a question so important that all the hand waving over it not being paleo leaves me less than satisfied.

Rapid evolution has been documented to have taken place over the last 10,000 years—including Devil’s Sperm like lactose tolerance (The 10,000 Year Explosion: How Civilization Accelerated Human Evolution). This is often put forth as a criticism of paleo when in fact, it’s the very best argument for paleo. Unfortunately, a moron like Marlene Zuk would fail to get the memo, or think too much before the imminent publication of her book in a few days….that which will doubtlessly prove to be a stupid screed on many levels of conventional dogma spouting ignorance: Paleofantasy: What Evolution Really Tells Us about Sex, Diet, and How We Live. (Not even knowing about the book, I did already take on some of the stupid articles by her and a friend, prefiguring it: here and here.)

Very slow evolution over the vast 2 million year span of the Paleolithic, contrasted with rapid evolution over the 10,000 year span of the Neolithic, if indeed how it happened, is a solid, very solid case to trend paleo in your dietary preferences.

Why? Because even though you are and always will be a sacrificial animal from the point of view of evolution logic, you possess an unintended evolutionary accident: a real mind, capable of understanding evolution and its mindless mathematical, amoral, reproductive logic. You can take a lookiesee: hey, evolution is happening rapidly…must be a bunch of bad shit causing that. Not earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, untold environmental upheaval, continental drift and climate change that would make a belching factory blush—but bad shit…like crap food cheaper and cheaper crowding out good shit. Grains are cheap. Grains. They are. From top to bottom and wall to wall they are the very cheapest staple food and evolution is responding in kind. ”Follow the money.” Let’s just get that straight.

You’re welcome to be part of evolution’s amoral, no concern for any individual nefarious scheme that counts as the biggest double-edge sword in the history of humanity (the good edge) and civilization (the double edge). I’ll lean Paleoish, thanks very much. My Paleoishness is not at all based—anymore, or, not that it ever really was—on what humans exactly ate in the paleo. Nor is it based, by consequence, on what they should not eat now. Not is a negation, and as such, not much help in a quest for positives. It’s what’s logical to eat from a paleo evolutionary framework, not deconstructed into constituant parts, and by God, that includes dairy and the most non-deconstructed, non processed of all: milk (ironic, eh?). And if one includes it at all, why not a a lot and see what happens, eh?

Bottom line is that your one and only life here and now is very important to you.

Chances are, you’ll do better by taking a dietary step back and let evolution take its course without your sacrificial participation, since you have something nobody in the Paleo possessed generally, in terms of human biology and its evolution: scientific knowledge; plus the knowledge of important anecdote, worldwide, right here and everywhere, thanks to Al Gore. And so there’s just another scientific bullshit for you: anecdote. It’s the idea that because it’s not scientifically precise (which is mostly a function of very small studies), that it’s worthless and of no value. Udder bullshit. Anecdote is not anathema to scientific research. It is its very basis. It absolutely has to be controlled for, and very tightly—which goes to the very discipline of the thing in the fist place. It can never, ever be dismissed.

…Weaning is equally a stupid argument. Animals don’t wean because milk suddenly becomes poison. Mammals wean because their moms have better things to do—like go bear offspring gain and birth another one; rinse, wash, repeat. Is 2 two short sentences enough on that stupid issue, or too much?

Milk Has Bad Stuff

Yea, I know, it’s insulinogenic. I’ll just point out that Type I diabetics aren’t typically only very lean because of a a lack of ability to store fat. Insulin matters.

And casein protein promotes cancer cell growth while whey seems to do the opposite. Ever stop to think that isolation and concentration might be a problem, in itself? Maybe both ways?

And allergies. Being lifelong sensitive to various pollens—especially grass pollen (scratch tests, so I know)—I find the notion a bit perplexing. See, there happens to be grass everywhere, including my own backyard. Does that mean isolation for me, because I’m allergic? It does mean I don’t roll around in it shirtless. Seriously, when I hear “I’m allergic,” I laugh. What does that mean? Anaphylactic shock leading to cardiac arrest, or you get a little itchy bump? Both fall under the category. …And don’t even get me started about how people—particularly women (you know I’m right)—use “oh, I’m allergic,” as euphemism for “I think your dish looks like crap and don’t even insist I take ‘just a taste.'”

Moving on, I took at this milk thing as I take all things Real Food and Paleoish (from a human evolutionary standpoint). Get this into heads: paleo is not about what cavemen ate, how they moved, slept, fucked, raised their children…or did without Breaking Bad on cable. It’s about what we evolved to eat, beginning with the basics and moving out from there. Dairy in all its forms, as a mammalian first essential beverage, is likely the very first logical choice.

Now that it’s under question, I’ll turn from criticizing the case against it in this part, to making the case for it in PART II, tomorrow. Part of this is my speculation that this and other forms of very high nutrition, raise things to think about in terms of the drug industry from the perspective of someone who sees the drug industry as a nice little baby, but in some very dirty filthy bathwater.

More tomorrow.z

Update: I neglected to address the A1 vs. A2 issue with milk. Here’s a study.

This review outlines a hypothesis that A1 one of the common variants of beta-casein, a major protein in cows milk could facilitate the immunological processes that lead to type I diabetes (DM-I). It was subsequently suggested that A1 beta-casein may also be a risk factor for coronary heart disease (CHD), based on between-country correlations of CHD mortality with estimated national consumption of A1 beta-casein in a selected number of developed countries. A company, A2 Corporation was set up in New Zealand in the late 1990s to test cows and market milk in several countries with only the A2 variant of beta-casein, which appeared not to have the disadvantages of A1 beta-casein. The second part of this review is a critique of the A1/A2 hypothesis. For both DM-I and CHD, the between-country correlation method is shown to be unreliable and negated by recalculation with more countries and by prospective studies in individuals. The animal experiments with diabetes-prone rodents that supported the hypothesis about diabetes were not confirmed by larger, better standardised multicentre experiments. The single animal experiment supporting an A1 beta-casein and CHD link was small, short, in an unsuitable animal model and had other design weaknesses. The A1/A2 milk hypothesis was ingenious. If the scientific evidence had worked out it would have required huge adjustments in the world’s dairy industries. This review concludes, however, that there is no convincing or even probable evidence that the A1 beta-casein of cow milk has any adverse effect in humans. This review has been independent of examination of evidence related to A1 and A2 milk by the Australian and New Zealand food standard and food safety authorities, which have not published the evidence they have examined and the analysis of it. They stated in 2003 that no relationship has been established between A1 or A2 milk and diabetes, CHD or other diseases.

Now here’s Mat “The Kraken” Lalonde, PhD, on someone’s Facebook thread a while back.

The whole A2 versus A1 milk issue was a fabrication by New Zealand farmers who wanted to sell more milk fro their A2 producing cows. Anyone with basic chemistry and biochemistry knowledge can cut through the arguments that were provided by the A2 side. The original studies were in vitro and did not use the full spectrum of enzymes that human beings possess for digestion. Dipeptidyl Peptidase IV and Prolyl Endopeptidase have the ability to shred BCM7 to pieces. For more information see: (a) Teschemaker, H.; Umbach, M.; Hamel, U.; Praetorius, K.; Ahert-Hilder, G.; Brantl, V.; Lottspeich, F.; Henschen, A. J. No Evidence for the Presence of b-Casomorphins in Human Plasma After Ingestion of Cow’s Milk or Milk Products. Dairy Res. 1986, 53, 135–138. (b) Hill, J. P.; Crawford, R. A.; Boland, M. J. Milk and Consumer Health: A Review of the Evidence for a Relationship Between the Consumption of Beta Casein A1 with Heart Disease and Insulin Dependent Diabetes Mellitus. Proc. NZ Soc. Animal Production 2002, 62, 111–114. (c) Truswell, A. S. The A2 Milk Case: A Critical Review. European Journal of Clinical Nutrition, 2005, 59, 623–631. (d) Chin-Dusting, J.; Shennan, J.; Jones, E.; Williams, C.; Kingwell, B.; Dart, A. Effect of Dietary Supplementation with b-Casein A1 or A2 on Markers of Disease Development in Individuals at High Risk of Cardiovascular Disease. British Journal of Nutrition. 2006, 95, 136–144


The effects of BMC7 are only manifested when the molecule is injected into human beings or lab animals. They do not manifest when the molecule is ingested. BMC7 is not detected in the guts of human beings when A1 milk is ingested. That is because of what I’ve mentioned earlier. The in vitro tests originally used to detect and isolate BMC7 did not have the full spectrum of human digestive enzymes. Human beings are fully capable of digesting BMC7. It is true that BMC7 is problematic when isolated from incomplete in vitro digestion and injected into human beings. However, there are no detrimental effects noted when A1 milk or BMC7 is ingested because human beings digest BMC7. Now if your view is that ilk is unhealthy, fine. Just don’t use BMC7 to justify your position. Milk is calorically dense and not very satiating (liquids do not cause a whole lot of stomach distension), as such, it is easily over consumed. This can lead to weight gain excess calcium and other problems. Add lactose and casein intolerance to the mix and you have plenty of legitimate reasons to avoid dairy. BMC7 is not one of them, however.

There’s more at the thread from Mat, if you want more info.

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  1. neal matheson on March 11, 2013 at 23:03

    In reference to reindeer herders, reindeer are only notionally domesticated and do revert occasionally. Reindeer herders specifically the Lapps were “encouraged” to herd reindeer by their southern neighbours and took up herding very recently. Herders don’t tend to ambush and shoot animals full of arrows as is attested to numerous Paleolithic and Mesolithic sites which makes domestication an unlikely prospect. Domesication of livestock though not as hard as arable farming is a more labour intensive lifestyle than hunting/gathering. If there is one thing about hunters they don’t like anything smelling of hard work.

  2. neal matheson on March 11, 2013 at 23:14

    A great many European populations not only adopted farming recently but also developed styles of farming which were less grain dependent and indeed low/zero carb for long periods of the year . Milk was also frequently converted to butter and cheese rather than consumed as a beverage. Northern Europeans (like what I am) have had considerably less time to evolve to eat wheat etc which presumably far less selection pressure (herring was the starvation/lean times food). There was a big jump in heights in Britain from the Neolithic to the Bronze age by about 10cm it would be interesting to know if this was caused by better farming/climate or genetic adaption to dairy.

    • Paul N on March 12, 2013 at 21:17

      I’d go with dairy.

      The two tallest peoples in the world – Dutch and Masai – both notorious milk eaters.
      Eating dairy in the teen years increases “linear” growth – I.e. makes you taller. It can be argued that too much dairy in the adult years will increase “radial” growth, but then, so will *too much* of almost anything, especially if you are sedentary.

  3. jakey on March 11, 2013 at 15:38

    “Has anyone ever stopped to consider what might be a reasonable model upon which to generally base a lifelong diet, specifically BECAUSE of the rough macronutrient composition of milk?”

    paul jaminet!

  4. Joshua on March 11, 2013 at 16:23

    I always like to point out that ants farm and milk aphids.

  5. Bill on March 11, 2013 at 16:27

    I’ve tried to obtain raw milk locally but so far failed. I think I’ve found a source for raw goat’s milk. I’ll go with that for a trial of producing kefir…
    Dr. Art Ayers has a good article about lactose/food intolerances.

  6. uey111 on March 11, 2013 at 16:39

    According to an article I’ve read, it takes only a few generations. The experiment was simple – there were some foxes and each generation the ones that were the least aggresive toward humans were bred. It only took a few generations for first signs of domestication (patches of different coloured fur) to appear. Cannot guarantee that the experiment was conducted exactly this way (I don’t remember it so well), but any differences would be relatively small and insignificant.

    After writing the whole thing, just noticed I’m answering to a quote, but whatever ^^”

  7. Bill on March 11, 2013 at 17:51

    Does this have anything to do with your recent love for kefir? FTR/BTW, I’m a fan of kefir, sauerkraut, etc.

  8. Thomas on March 11, 2013 at 18:52

    So, no boredom issues yet? (I had the same boredom issues with potatoes that you did.)

  9. Tom on March 11, 2013 at 18:53

    So, no boredom issues yet? (I had the same boredom issues with potatoes that you did.)

  10. Kat on March 11, 2013 at 19:25

    I’d rather do 50% protein, 30% carb and 20% fat, but I agree that milk is more paleo than refined oils and better than nuts!

  11. Robert on March 11, 2013 at 19:26

    Get a copy of “Devil in the Milk” by Keith Woodford.
    Main takeaways – a mutation in European cattle (between 5000 and 10000 years ago) put high amounts of BCM-7 in the milk (a1 gene). This is not present in a2 gene African and Asian cattle (such as the Masai pastoralists rely on).
    BCM-7 intake is correlated to coronary heart disease and type 1 diabetes. It is in any case a strong opioid. It may be one of the causes of autistic behaviour and is probably the element of milk that is blamed for lactose intolerance.
    So the takeaway for paleo is that black and white cow milk isn’t paleo because it’s the product of a post-agriculture era mutation.

    • Richard Nikoley on March 12, 2013 at 08:20

      Ha, I happened upon the bit by Lalonde re a1 v a2. At least part of it. As I recall there was some ongoing discussion but didn’t amount to much.

    • Richard Nikoley on March 11, 2013 at 20:42

      I looked at the a1 a2 thing a while back and only found conflicting info. I think it was on Robb Wolfe’s FB page a while back but Matt Lanonde basically said the whole thing was bogus and not to be concerned about, though I don’t recall the specifics.

    • Richard Nikoley on March 12, 2013 at 08:28

      OK, found the whole original thread (you might have to click on “view previous comments”)

    • Robert on March 13, 2013 at 02:43

      Thanks for looking into it and expanding your post. I would again suggest Woodford’s book (published 2009) which discusses and refutes the conclusions reached by the 1st and 3rd quotes and Lalondes’ argument that BCM-7 is broken down by digestive enzymes is challenged here :

      My thinking is related to the Paleo issue. The A1 gene is a post-agriculture mutation that does not exist in older cattle breeds, and therefore the milk _version_ couldn’t be in our ancestor diet.

    • Om Shanti Om on March 17, 2013 at 23:13

      “This is not present in a2 gene African and Asian cattle (such as the Masai pastoralists rely on).”

      Interesting. My Hindu family in South Asia (India to be exact) were always going on about how “cows are different in the West.” Our cows (in India) have lumps on their backs, as do African cows. Its interesting to note also there is very little lactose intolerance in South Asian countries. Cows milk and cow milk products have been staples in our cuisines for several thousands of years.

      In fact, the cow took on a favored symbolic role in our cultures because her milk provided us with so much nutrition.

  12. TempestTcup on March 12, 2013 at 07:31

    Between you & Matt Forney (link below) I finally got off my tush to search for raw dairy & I recently found an adorable little dairy (est. 1923) about 15 minutes away where I can get raw milk & cream. My husband is going back today to get a bunch more – I’ve been drinking a cup or so of milk a little before bedtime & cream with my coffee. I tried the whole resistant starch thing, but I found that my body really doesn’t like carbs much (older female). It does really seem to like the raw milk & cream, though. I haven’t tried making kefir yet, but I do make my own yogurt. Anyway I’m continuing on with this until my body tells me different!

  13. Paul on March 12, 2013 at 09:36

    Just as a personal note, raw dairy (including milk) and potatoes now make up about 40% of the calories I eat/drink (along with pastured eggs, anchovies, fruit and meat – no leafy green vegetables – *gasp*), and I’ve never felt better in my life – a ton of energy, excellent body composition, zero colds/sickness.

    In fact, your posts about potatoes 4 or 5 months ago are what convinced me to give potatoes a go again.

    I’m really looking forward to your post tomorrow – great stuff

  14. Richard Nikoley on March 12, 2013 at 09:53

    Just added a substantial update to the post concerning the A1/A2 non-issue.

  15. Cody on March 12, 2013 at 13:34

    Richard, thanks for putting the A1/A2 thing to bed. I love milk and diary in all of their forms and that was the one niggling thing in my mind as I enjoyed my whole milk.

    What about raw vs. pasteurized? What’s the data on that?

    • Richard Nikoley on March 12, 2013 at 14:37

      I think quality of the farm is vastly more important than the pasteurization/homogenization issue.

      I get this milk often:

      It’s pasteurized but cream top and is a highly regarded dairy. Raw is the better way to go but if it’s too hard to get find the smallest dairy/creamery you can and do business with them.

  16. Zen on March 12, 2013 at 16:15

    I especially liked this gem.

    “Because even though you are and always will be a sacrificial animal from the point of view of evolution logic, you possess an unintended evolutionary accident: a real mind, capable of understanding evolution and its mindless mathematical, amoral, reproductive logic.”

  17. Bill Strahan on March 12, 2013 at 19:22

    I have been very curious about this stuff, Richard. I’m in the middle of doing the CrossFit Open competition stuff so I didn’t want to totally throw a wrench in the works, but decided I’d squeeze in a few days. Last Friday I stocked up on 3 gallons of raw milk in prep for about 3 days experimenting.

    Saturday my post workout meal was nothing but 24 oz raw milk and a kombucha. I drank all the raw milk I wanted the rest of the day. Ended up at a little less than a gallon. I also had about 8 oz plain yogurt and 8 oz goat milk kefir.

    That general pattern continued for Sunday, except I did not workout. Monday I again had nothing but a 24 oz raw milk and kombucha post workout. I decided that night that I was going to stop at 3 days.

    Results? I feel great, set a couple of personal records in the gym today, and dropped just over 3 pounds in 3 days. Today I added sweet potato to the post workout raw milk, and have now transitioned back to solid food. The transition was seamless, and I still feel great.

    I was never hungry, didn’t quite manage a full gallon of milk on any day, and felt incredibly strong today. I’m back to sold food for now, but may play with this for a longer duration after the CrossFit Open is over. My goal this year is to be top 10% worldwide in my age group, and I’m sitting at top 9% after the first workout. 4 weeks and 4 workouts to go…

    • Richard Nikoley on March 12, 2013 at 19:39

      That’s great news Bill. So you you begin to see my frustration with the complete automatic dismissal because it’s not Paleo. I’m drafting Part 2 now. Newsletter update on my week after that.

      As circumstance would have it, I’m back from the gym myself just now. I haven’t worked out in 3 weeks but was anxious to get back. Last time I just gingerly did 185 on DLs 3×10. Today there were some guys on the rack so I asked they just leave it when done. They had 265 on it, so I just jumped right on. No problem with 2×5. Feel great.

      Another anecdote is that at my old gym in San Jose, there was this one skinny, ectomorph trainer guy who used to do all that “balance exercise” crap like standing on that half ball with 10lb dumbells and similar “exercises.” So the other day, I see this guy behind me in line at Trader Joe’s. Quite built up, in gym dress, and in his hand for the checkout was a quart of goat’s milk and a pound bag of jerky. I’m thinking “definitely post workout meal.” Now, guess who that guy turned out to be? Yep, he’s training at a new gym and they’re into lifting real weight.

    • Bill Strahan on March 13, 2013 at 07:13

      Real weights are pretty key. I hope you’ll take a good read of Bending The Aging Curve. You’ll never go more than a couple of weeks without the heavy weights again once you read it. In a nutshell, as we age we can lose fast twitch muscle fibers as they take a one-way conversion to slow twitch. Bad news. The best preservation is…heavy weights.

      I can’t recall if I said it here, or a different blog, but I think Paleo is an interesting framework to provide a basis for creating a hypothesis as to what MIGHT work for you…and what might NOT work for you. From that framework, I think it’s likely that grains are bad for me, and meat and fat are good for me. But I can easily test that to see. So the “Paleo” part is just giving me a good starting point.

      As to “It’s not Paleo”, neither is clean drinking water. Neither is contraception. Neither is chewing gum. Etc, etc. So, I think my diet is what anyone who knows would call Paleo. I eat meat, vegetables, a little bit of fruit and occasional nuts. But the BCAA and cup of coffee I have pre workout, and the raw milk and whey I take post workout aren’t Paleo. I know they’re not. But I have tested them extensively on myself and I know they WORK.

      For diet, relationships, exercise, finances, hobbies, and choice of toothbrush, I like to use what works. :)

  18. Bill Strahan on March 12, 2013 at 19:24

    Forgot to add, I am noticeably leaner now than 3 days ago. My abs, chest, and shoulders are more defined.

    My wife asked if she should try the “raw milk diet” and I pointed out that she hates milk. Her reply, with a smile, “Not with cookies.” God, I love her!

  19. […] Here's Part 1 for review, where I critiqued what I believe are the chief arguments in favor of avoiding milk from a Paleo, evolutionary perspective. I neglected to address the A1 vs. A2 genetic lineage of dairy producing cows, and so I added that as an update to the post this morning. […]

  20. Dr. Curmudgon Gee on March 14, 2013 at 19:30

    i’m glad you brought up the issue of A2 vs. A1.

    the obsession of coconut of some paleo eaters, is one thing i don’t really get.

    coconut this, coconut that, it’s a little reminiscence of obsession of soy for some veg*n’s.

    coconut + cauliflower & almond are the few things that irritate me most about MDA.

    i do like coconut a great deal tho. but it is not a staple of my forefather. maybe that’s why it disagrees w/ my tummy.


  21. Om Shanti Om on March 18, 2013 at 11:28

    I’ve noticed a lot of people who claim “paleo” have gotten a large share of their recipes from the raw vegan community (those who don’t cook their food).

    Spiralized zucchini pasta, using lettuce or other green leaves as the “bread” on a sandwich, lots of coconut recipes, etc.

    Practically speaking there is no such thing as “paleo” eating in today’s world.

    I eat a large amount and colorful variety of raw, cooked and fermented vegetables, along with fruit, soaked and sprouted nuts, seeds, and legumes, and occasionally cooked grains and dairy.

    As an Indian cooked grains and dairy were main staples growing up but too much of a good thing can be harmful so as an adult I’ve scaled back on both and have lost considerable weight and gained more energy.

    The important thing is to research what nutrients the body needs to function optimally and eat the freshest foods possible that provide them, rather than marry oneself off to a “diet” which acts as a ball and chain.

  22. Richard Nikoley on March 18, 2013 at 11:53

    “I’ve scaled back on both and have lost considerable weight and gained more energy.”

    And where is that energy coming from? And how about the weight. How certain are you, in a rather low protein regime, that you’re not losing just fat, but lean mass as well?

    ….To clarify, that goes with the territory in obesity. 25% of the gain for an obese person is lean mass (75% is fat). When losing weight, it’s going to be both. However, lean mass is very valuable and is the primary fuel for the immune system. As Art DeVany says, when people die of old age, it’s because they’ve lost 40% of their lean mass over time.

    It’s not so much the quantity of protein that matters (so long as in the 10ish percent range or better) but the quality. In terms of natural foods, dairy is the star. This is the secret to success of the vegetarian Indians over the millennia. That they now cut back and use vegetable oils instead of ghee and such is a shame.

    Incidentally, and just so you know, a Brit friend took me to a curry house for my first time on Pattaya Beach in Thailand in about 1987. I’ve been a fan since and from time to time, even do my own lamb curries not totally from scratch (roasting the spices) but I assemble them instead of just defaulting to curry powder.

    but plain yellow curry powder is marvelous in its own right and I often put it in very unconventional things. For example, tuna salad. Just enough to where people say “what’s that?” I do that with a lot of things. Same for wasabi in mashed potatoes.

    • Om Shanti Om on March 18, 2013 at 15:57

      “And where is that energy coming from? And how about the weight. How certain are you, in a rather low protein regime, that you’re not losing just fat, but lean mass as well?”

      Energy is coming from all the nutrients in my nutrient dense food.
      I’m not doing low protein, I’m getting high protein from greens, sprouts and all the moringa trees I’m growing in my yard.
      Fat is plentiful in coconuts, avacados and soaked/sprouted nuts.

      I do use dairy, but not as much as I used to. I occasionally use ghee simply because I love the taste.

      Being Indian I cannot give up my acquired taste for Indian cuisines but I just make them healthier now, such as sprouted raw channa masala instead of the non-sprouted and over-cooked traditional version, sprouting all my Indian lentils, etc. I also indulge in the occasional naan, roti, paratha, samosa, etc, even though those grains are not healthy to take daily like Indians do and its one of the reasons those Indians who over-indulge are often obese and have other health issues. The sedentary lifestyle of many modern Indians doesn’t help either.

      The yellow curry is “turmeric” and has a lot of health benefits.

      One section of my family is a long line of Ayurvedic physicians so I have been tutored by them in the nutritional value of many of the indigenous leaves, herbs, vegetables and fruits native to India and its the reason I grow the “miracle tree” moringa in my back yard here in the States.

    • Richard Nikoley on March 18, 2013 at 16:23

      That’s cool, Om Shanti Om. You know, I have had an uncharacteristic number of Indian readers and commenters over the years, always considered it a blessing. We have many Indian friends here locally as my wife has taught many of their children in school, so we get invited to various parties often and invite them to ours. One of my favorite indulgences is the spinach fritters and the onion fritters. I could eat them to the point of sickness.

      Shoot me an email if you would, please. I have something for you. Email is on my about page.

  23. Om Shanti Om on March 19, 2013 at 19:26

    Now you’ve sparked my curiosity. What ya got for me?

    “One of my favorite indulgences is the spinach fritters and the onion fritters. I could eat them to the point of sickness.”

    Pakoras? Deep fried? Even if they’re deep fried in ghee, eating them on the regular would cause weight gain. The traditional Indian cuisines from a few hundred years ago are healthy. Since the introduction of mono-agriculture, the “green revolution” and Monsanto, there’s been a steady rise in waist lines and health problems in middle class and up Indians in India.

    The lower classes, ironically enough, eat much healthier!

  24. Richard Nikoley on March 19, 2013 at 20:08

    “What ya got for me?”

    Check your inbox. Forgot that I have everyone’s email who comments.

    [Oops, I guess that’s not your real address. Bounced.]

  25. Om Shanti Om on March 19, 2013 at 20:48

    ok ill email you with my real address

  26. […] a Paleo Template that embraces Primal and Perfect Health Dieters, high-quality, raw dairy (if you tolerate it well), and “safe starches” from fruit and vegetable […]

  27. […] I've actually experimented with an all milk and kefir (a form of fermented milk) diet (and Part 2) on the order of 5 or 6 weeks. Guess what? It works. Guess why? Duh! It's complete nutrition. Been around for millions of years, too. Tried & tested. […]

  28. Angelina Jolie’s Double Breast Mastectomy and Morning Wood w/ Richard Nikoley of Free The Animal (May 14, 2013) on September 23, 2013 at 18:41

    […] especially fascinated by his new experiment: Raw Milk, Raw Kefir, Raw Kombucha Intervention Diet. He demonstrates what I’ve indicated in my book Defying Age With Food: Reclaim Your Health, […]

  29. Jake on October 14, 2013 at 13:50

    Right on about milk! Funny thing, when I was a kid I thought I was lactose intolerant. As I got a few years older I tried milk and I wasn’t.

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